Formula 1 2014!

Ruben · Post by **Ruben** » 16 Mar 2013, 13:34

Pawq wrote:I remember some time ago there was a discussion about whether F1 drivers have exceptional skills or are just average hoylas with wealthy parents (zweq was on the second side I think...?)
I think it's pretty interesting to watch this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cgdTi1tlZYo

Bear in mind that the guy talking/driving is Richard Meaden, editor of 'evo', a sports car magazine, a guy who has been driving sports/racing cars since he was born.
1300bhp/ton makes you think about it... (for comparison, ferrari 458 has 380bhp/ton)

Well, Richard Hammond sure as hell needs A LOT more hoyling...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EGUZJVY-sHo

Chris · Post by **Chris** » 16 Mar 2013, 16:06

I hate waking up early in the weekends. What if there is rain again? Then I will wake up for nothing

I know that I can use DVR and watch race whenever I want, but it's not the same and I can't resist checking results.

Chris · Post by **Chris** » 17 Mar 2013, 08:36

Tigro · Post by **Tigro** » 17 Mar 2013, 12:56

I simply LOVE Kimi´s face expressions

one tiny smile during the whole ceremony. Like a boss!
Ferraris are obv in better conditions than previous season, Fernando made nice job. After seeing the Q2 and Q3 I was almost sure Vettel/Webber will take double this time, and both failed..

Chris · Post by **Chris** » 17 Mar 2013, 13:32

Kimi is the best

Ferrari is the best car, but Lotus is only slightly slower. I think Alonso lost race, because he was stuck behind Massa. Red Bull is a bit behind Lotus and Ferrari, but they may suddenly find some pace and pull away like last year. Mercedes, as usual struggle with tires despite being very fast over one lap. McLaren is catastrophe.

pawq · Post by **pawq** » 18 Mar 2013, 15:30

Guys, it's too early to judge which car is the fastest. There are too many random factors involved in just one race, traffic and strategy among them. Apparently Ferrari, RBR and Lotus are about equally fast, with Mercedes slightly behind, and that means no domination, at least in the early stage of the season. YAY! McLaren sucks indeed, sadly enough. Let's hope for a quick recovery :) Sick job Sutil and Force India too, reminds me of good ol' 2011 ;)
Max race! The most lovable kind, I can't wait for Malaysia :)

Tigro · Post by **Tigro** » 18 Mar 2013, 15:47

happily there is not a 2week break, just one week now.

pawq · Post by **pawq** » 19 Mar 2013, 00:24

yeah, but 3 weeks after that :(

Polarix · Post by **Polarix** » 24 Mar 2013, 11:03

I support Vettel with this malaysia race. Good job Vettel, true racing

Tigro · Post by **Tigro** » 24 Mar 2013, 11:39

i have seen only first 10 laps (then went to church), but i think i have seen eonough to have a good day

Hamilton pit-fail was so ridiculous, i roflmaoed totally

pity Alonso, he should have had gone to pits after first lap..
Vettel great as always. Go go.

Grace · Post by **Grace** » 24 Mar 2013, 11:39

^ It would be fine if he legitimately passed him on the track, but that's not the case. Both drivers were told to turn down their engines to conserve engine life (to around 60% power - a 40% reduction) - Webber did so, obeying his team orders and leaving him with a car that was mapped significantly slower than Vettel's, which is supported by Webber losing 6 seconds in the subsequent laps with better tyres.

If Vettel had obeyed team orders to turn his engine down, he never would have caught and passed Mark. Likewise, if Mark had NOT turned his engine down, Vettel still wouldn't have passed him. Vettel disobeyed team orders for his own personal satisfaction even though time and time again mark has done the right thing by him.

Rest assured, Vettel is not a popular boy in the red bull garage right now. The only person on his side is his race engineer. When you have a man with the status of Christian Horner telling him he's being a twat, you know he's being a twat.

Basically he made the biggest asshole move he could have in that situation - how selfish can one man be?

Nonetheless, interesting race. Disappointed for Alonso and Rosberg.

Tigro · Post by **Tigro** » 24 Mar 2013, 11:46

nevertheless, you can´t really know what happens behind the scenes... None of us knows.

pawq · Post by **pawq** » 24 Mar 2013, 12:24

No reason to defend Vettel. He is a twat who can't lose, and it is a point of honour for him to finish ahead of Webber, so he'd do it at all cost. It seems the last race was an incredible exception from his selfishness. Asshole.
What Brown did with Nico is just frightening, fucking fat pig letting Hamilton win just to pat him on the head and say "see Lewis, you can be good with us too". Poor, poor Nico... The worst possible situation for him at the moment. How I wish he was taken to a team like Force India or Lotus, and be allowed to win there... I wish he had more balls too :/

Alonso crashed at his own will, he deserved it.

Ruined race for me, I'm so very disappointed. With Vettel above all. Unfortunately, he's a champion, so neither Horner, nor nobody else will be able to speak to his mind. When I saw Webber entering after the waiting room after the race... I felt like killing Vettel. I'm so much on Webber's side!

It should be Vettel and Hamilton in one team, Rosberg and Webber in another. A team of fast assholes to hate, and a team of fast pussies to feel sorry for.

Also, what a miserable fail in the pitlane...

Ruben · Post by **Ruben** » 24 Mar 2013, 18:12

No pity for Alonso, he deserved it (both because he's generally a twat, and because he didn't go into the pit lane).

I don't have much against Vettel, but today's preformance was disgusting.

I feel sorry for Kimi having such a bad start. At least he managed to climb back up to 7th.

Hammilton and Rosberg... Terrible desicion by Mercedes, but creds to Rosberg for not being a dick (unlike someone else I shan't mention) (Hint: Vettel).

Lousku · Post by **Lousku** » 27 Mar 2013, 22:38

old?

Tigro · Post by **Tigro** » 28 Mar 2013, 00:22

Sebastian Vettel wrote:I messed up today. I would love to come up with a nice excuse as to why I did it, but I can’t. I can understand Mark’s frustration and the team not being happy with what I did today; I owe an explanation to him and the whole team. I will try to explain to them later. We talk about this situation happening many times and what we will do if and when it happens and normally it doesn’t, but today it did and I should have translated the call into action. I got the call and I ignored it. Mark and I are used to fighting each other when we’re close, but with the tyres how they are now, and not knowing how long they will last, it was an extremely big risk to ignore the call to stay second. We could have ended up finishing eighth or ninth after destroying the tyres in those two laps; I put myself above a team decision, which was wrong. I didn’t mean to and I apologise. I’m not happy I’ve won, I made a mistake and if I could undo it I would. It’s not easy right now and I owe apologies to Mark and the team.

Mark Webber wrote:I think Sebastian has respect for me and I have respect for him, but the situation today was not handled well. It’s hard to put your finger on it all now after the race; when we’re racing on the limit and pushing as hard as we can, then it’s the worst situation for a team. I am sure they are bricking themselves and know that things can go wrong. There’s a bit of history to this as well; my mind in the last 15 laps was thinking about a lot of things, but I was happy with the way I drove. I tried to isolate what happened at the end and we got something out of it today, but of course I’m not satisfied with the result. This puts heat on a few people and unfortunately there’s no rewind button. I know people want raw emotion from us after these situations and it’s there, but we need to remain cool. There’s three weeks until the next race, so time for us to work on things.

Christian Horner wrote:Before getting into anything else, it was a phenomenal team performance from the car and pit crew today with the pit crew recording fantastically fast stops. We recorded our fastest ever time on Mark’s second stop, which is possibly a new best-ever in the pit lane. Obviously there’s an awful lot of debate about what happened at the end of the race. Our position after that finial pit stop was all about managing the race until the end and conserving our tyres, getting the cars to the finish and achieving maximum points. Unfortunately drivers’ interests can sometimes come into conflict with the teams’. Sebastian decided to take things into his own hands today and race Mark, thankfully making a clean pass and switching the order to the flag. It’s frustrating. Formula One is both a team and an individual sport and sometimes there is a conflict between a driver’s desire and a team’s interest. What happened today is something that shouldn’t have happened. It’s something that Sebastian has apologised for and it’s something that we will discuss internally as a team.

Chris · Post by **Chris** » 28 Mar 2013, 01:47

Seb just joined elite along with Fangio and shumi. Fangio even got car from his teammate just to finish race. Seb is in elite club along with Schumi, Kimi and others.

http://www.darrenheath.com/season/2013/ ... i-meltdown

27th March 2013

What’s all the fuss about? Why is everyone getting so agitated?

A reigning three-times Formula 1 world champion saw an opportunity and he took it, regardless of the voice crackling in his earpiece bearing the coded instruction “multi 21”.

Seriously, that should come as no surprise to anyone with the tiniest appreciation of the mindset of the greats of our – or any other – sport.

I know, I know; team orders, gentlemanly conduct, a fair fight, blah, blah, blah. This is the real world of cut-throat, top-level, piranha-pool F1 and Sebastian Vettel isn’t about to start looking gift horses in the mouth anytime soon.

Vettel, in his new position as Red Bull team principal, is just a reflection of where F1 is right now. The drivers have the power – the top four guys that is, the racers with the elusive ‘X’ factor, desired by so many, possessed by so few.

Lewis, Fernando, Sebastian and Kimi.

Not so long ago things were a little different; F1 teams were ruled by strong characters who were, in their own unique ways, mostly impressive men. Todt, Tyrrell, Dennis, Williams, Chapman, Briatore to name just a few. Sure they weren’t always likeable and could certainly be unpopular, but one was under no illusion that each was the boss and it was their way or no way.

Sitting on their big cheese pitwall perches these days are men (and a woman) who perhaps possess a little less in the either-you-have-it-or-you-don’t department of charisma.

It should therefore be entirely predictable, and certainly not shocking, that when Vettel is asked to play second fiddle to team mate Mark Webber, the German responds by waving a dismissive two-fingered salute instead of the usual one!

Ferrari will do whatever Alonso desires, Lotus adore “Leave me alone” Kimi, and German über-brand Mercedes have made it quite clear they favour their English main man Lewis over his team-mate Nico Rosberg, regardless of the black, red and gold flag beside Nico’s name.

The ‘famous four’ rule the roost and it’s not going to change anytime soon.

The post-Malaysian grand prix press conference room sizzled with tension as the three podium-placed drivers arrived. Glum faces, dismissive glances, pregnant pauses, empty apologies – this memorable 20-minute affair was a ‘joy’ to attend.

Debate will rage. The whys and wherefores, wrongs and rights, reasons and excuses for what went down at Sepang 2013 will run and run, but we can all be sure in the knowledge that it will happen again and again and again.

’Twas ever thus. At the head of the field there will be the racers who refuse to accept second place, who dismiss – when it suits – the rules of fair play; the men who achieve, the guys who set the bar at dizzying heights most can only dream of reaching.

Malaysia 2013 may well be the race at which Sebastian Vettel joined that legendary list.

Welcome to the club.

pawq · Post by **pawq** » 28 Mar 2013, 19:30

Tigro - what Vettel said after the race is absolutely irrelevant. There is nothing else he could've said under the pressure. But what he did on track remains.

Chris - nobody's taking the points away from him, nobody's saying that he's a bad driver now, but he is an asshole and what you pasted doesn't contradict this. With such a ruthless attitude he probably will achieve more than otherwise, and I doubt he does, or ever will, regret it, but I, and many people alike, don't appreciate that. It's probably one of the reasons why some people are hostile towards him.

I know Button will never achieve great things (he still is a world champion, what people tend to forget, but what I have in mind is something extraordinary, achievement comparable with Vettel's). Nevertheless, he is my favourite driver on track. That's partly because, despite being a very competitive championship contender, he remains a fair, honourable, sensible and considerate man. Boring? Perhaps, but I do appreciate him for that.

Zweq · Post by **Zweq** » 28 Mar 2013, 19:56

I guess the point was that if webber didn't follow the instructions either(save the car or something) he'd have won

Ruben · Post by **Ruben** » 28 Mar 2013, 21:51

I hate these fucking team commands, it only results in shitty races like this last one. Whether F1 is a team sport or an individual sport has been quite heavily debated throughout the years — especially now — but it's an unnecessary debate. It's definetly an individal sport, it's just these fucking teams that won't let the drives fight just because they're on the same team. One of the greatest battle of all time was between to teammates, and this thanks to both of them not giving a shit about what they were told to do; Villeneuve vs Pironi

Tigro · Post by **Tigro** » 28 Mar 2013, 21:52

Zweg: sure. We could have seen some struggles between Mark and Seb in the past, once resulting in both retiring from 1st and 2nd place, because of in-team rivality. I guess they do not like each other, they just bear each other.

Pawg: Button is my favourite driver too, mostly because of his surprising experiments which have extraordinary results on track, as well as his team which supports this. And he really is a good driver. English gentleman.
I was big Vettel´s fan, but i am now reconsidering this attitude. We will see in the next weeks.

Grace · Post by **Grace** » 29 Mar 2013, 10:26

Tigro wrote:Zweg: sure. We could have seen some struggles between Mark and Seb in the past, once resulting in both retiring from 1st and 2nd place, because of in-team rivality. I guess they do not like each other, they just bear each other.

Pawg: Button is my favourite driver too, mostly because of his surprising experiments which have extraordinary results on track, as well as his team which supports this. And he really is a good driver. English gentleman.
I was big Vettel´s fan, but i am now reconsidering this attitude. We will see in the next weeks.

Yes, and the time that they both retired due to in-team rivalry (Turkey 2010, for those interested) was due to sebastian disobeying orders.

It's pretty clear. Vettel won a race he did not deserve to win due to being a greedy and selfish twat. No way he could have passed mark on slower tires if he hadn't turned his engine down.

pawq · Post by **pawq** » 30 Mar 2013, 18:42

Tigro wrote:Button (...) English gentleman.

+1

I'm really looking forward to the next races. Vettel's under very heavy criticism these days, I'm curious if he will back up a little because of it, like Hamilton did at some point last year. I certainly hope so, Hamilton became much more bearable as a consequence of that, and he started being more reliable in racing terms too.

pawq · Post by **pawq** » 14 Apr 2013, 13:07

Cool race, I like such strategic mambo jumbo, especially Button impressive, too bad he's so SLOW :U

absolutely lols at Kimi's nose :D

and omfg end, 0.2s... :D If it weren't Vettel, I'd like him to win the battle

Tigro · Post by **Tigro** » 14 Apr 2013, 14:27

I once again saw oly the first 5 laps

but from now on I will see them whole

Ruben · Post by **Ruben** » 14 Apr 2013, 21:17

This race was so awesome compared to last one. A gazillion different styles that caused a gazillion different people to be in the lead at some point in the race. Kimi making it to 2nd with a Stephen Fry style broken nose was impressive, especially after such an appalling start (again).

pawq · Post by **pawq** » 15 Apr 2013, 03:09

The team apologised to him for the start, so it would seem to be some sort of mechanical/electronic failure. But I agree with the first part :) Also 20th finished race in a row for Kimi, woooo!

Chris · Post by **Chris** » 15 Apr 2013, 11:59

Pawq wrote:The team apologised to him for the start, so it would seem to be some sort of mechanical/electronic failure. But I agree with the first part Also 20th finished race in a row for Kimi, woooo!

There was no failure. The clutch settings for starts are based on start practice. Lotus screwed it. Drivers don't use clutch later in race.

pawq · Post by **pawq** » 15 Apr 2013, 16:56

Fucked up settings then. Still, not Kimi's fault.

Kortsu · Post by **Kortsu** » 21 Apr 2013, 15:05

Nice race by Kimi once again, Lotus going strong! Very entertaining battles throughout the race.

Ruben · Post by **Ruben** » 21 Apr 2013, 16:09

Yeah, the entire grid (except Sebastian) was fighting pretty much all the way to the end. Amazing race from Lotus, whose both drivers had mediocre Saturdays and outstanding Sundays.

Chris · Post by **Chris** » 21 Apr 2013, 16:32

It's the same podium as in 2012. One conclusion is that Mercedes isn't yet there to fight for the wins. They have excellent one lap pace, but they eat tires with heavy fuel loads. Shame we didn't see what Alonso could have done. Probably the best race so far this season.

pawq · Post by **pawq** » 21 Apr 2013, 19:19

What a sick race! Perez going wild :D I absolutely loved it, I agree it was the most entertaining race of the season so far. And no accident! That's genuilnely impressive with all those wheel-to-wheel battles going on!
Very solid performance by Vettel and Alonso as always, Lotus not failing to impress once again. A huge disappointment for me personally, because of Button's fucked up last 2 stints :( At one point he had a perspective for podium, but then it vanished along with his pace :/
Sick di Resta too! Too bad he didn't manage to retain that podium :p
What I don't agree with, is this in relation to Mercedes' unability to fight for the wins:

Chris wrote:They have excellent one lap pace, but they eat tires with heavy fuel loads.

Rosberg was the slowest of the whole front pack (including both McLarens, di Resta in his Force India, Massa in his Ferrari, etc.) since the very first corner, where the only tyre degradation comes from the qualifying lap on low fuel. On the other hand, as Hamilton and Rosberg progressed further into the race, they gained a noticable advantage over the competition as their tyres were running out. For me it doesn't seem like tyre degradation is the issue, but rather the lack of raw race pace due to whatever. What are your opinions on this?

Chris · Post by **Chris** » 21 Apr 2013, 23:14

This is just my speculation.

Actually Rosberg for some reason lacked pace during closing laps IIRC. I can be wrong. On the other hand Hamilton indeed had good pace to even overtake Webber. The lack of race pace is result of higher degradation during first laps and as a result compromised strategy for the rest of race (pit stops timing). In later part of race with lower fuel loads as fuel is burnt quickly they can drive quite fast, but as I said their races are already compromised. This is how I can explain good one lap pace. In other words, the qualifying sessions are driven with little fuel on board and Mercedes is fast there. Races begin with a lot of fuel on board and Mercedes struggle there, although this is not definitive rule. Sometimes they have quite reasonable pace during whole race like in Malaysia or Oz, sometimes not. Some tracks suit their car, some not. Lotus on the other hand is too kind on tyres and they can't heat them and they struggle during quali and out laps. Red Bull is somewhere in between.

pawq · Post by **pawq** » 21 Apr 2013, 23:47

Yeah all that sounds pretty reasonable :p Look at the transformation of McLaren though, Button was once able to do less pitstops than everybody less, now both of them have to do more than most of the guys...

Grace · Post by **Grace** » 22 Apr 2013, 04:34

Chris wrote:This is just my speculation.

On the other hand Hamilton indeed had good pace to even overtake Webber.

Not indicative, Webber was slow as balls when Hamilton overtook him.

Pawq wrote:Yeah all that sounds pretty reasonable :p Look at the transformation of McLaren though, Button was once able to do less pitstops than everybody less, now both of them have to do more than most of the guys...

Yeah and it's not because of their driving. Button has one of the smoothest driving styles and is quite good on his tired. He also rarely locks the brakes. Perez showed last year he has some gift with tyre preservation and it seems to be the only thing keeping him from four-stopping that race.

Chris · Post by **Chris** » 13 May 2013, 14:38

That Mercedes is seriously weird car. I'm glad that Ferrari and Lotus are doing well.

pawq · Post by **pawq** » 26 May 2013, 15:35

HOW KIMI PULLED THAT OFF...

Huge kisses to Nico, he finally got it! And good race from Perez, but he deserved it for almost spoiling Kimi's spree. imo.
And gz Sutil :))) And fuck Alonso :))) And dafuq Grosjean, as always...

Tigro · Post by **Tigro** » 26 May 2013, 15:39

I would rather blame Kimi for that collision... as well as I fell asleep after 21 laps... Bit boring, when we do not count SC releases and their reasons.

Grace · Post by **Grace** » 26 May 2013, 16:05

What an incredible effort from Raikkonen to make it back into the top10 after his puncture. Supreme driving from Rosberg - felt like he couldn't be touched.

Perez and Sutil showing why they are classier drivers than people think they are, as well.

pawq · Post by **pawq** » 26 May 2013, 18:37

Blame Kimi? He was following his own racing line. Perez was behind and should realise that Kimi is going to turn in eventually, and there's going to be no space there for him. I don't think there's anyone to blame here, but I was angry with Perez because he was trying to pull off that risky move the 3rd time, and it had to fail some time. It just happened that at the same time he almost knocked out Kimi, who definitely did not deserve that.

I agree that both Sutil and Perez showed off their skills today, but I think Perez should ease off a bit already. Crossing chicanes not to be overtaken by his own teammate? Pushing others through chicanes? A tiny wee bit too aggressive for my standards. Sutil was perfect :)

Chris · Post by **Chris** » 26 May 2013, 21:51

Tigro wrote:I would rather blame Kimi for that collision... as well as I fell asleep after 21 laps... Bit boring, when we do not count SC releases and their reasons.

Perez was never going to make it. He was too far behind Kimi. He cannot force drivers by braking late locking his wheels to cut chicanes. Kimi wasn't as nice as Alonso. Perez must think few steps ahead. Drivers like Kimi, Alonso or Vettel know it when they overtake.

pawq · Post by **pawq** » 27 May 2013, 01:11

Chris wrote:Perez was never going to make it. He was too far behind Kimi. He cannot force drivers by braking late locking his wheels to cut chicanes. Kimi wasn't as nice as Alonso. Perez must think few steps ahead. Drivers like Kimi, Alonso or Vettel know it when they overtake.

+1

Ruben · Post by **Ruben** » 30 May 2013, 17:41

Every Monaco I expect something different, but as usual half the race is done behind SC, there's a red flag at some point, and it all goes on for 2h+. Kudos to Kimi for taking Hulkenberg and getting 1 point, that puncture was not his fault in any damn way whatsoever. I feel bad for Massa though, he's not the one to make those kinds of mistakes. Sadly, the price you have to pay is gargantual even for the tiniest mistakes when you're in Monaco.

pawq · Post by **pawq** » 30 May 2013, 18:04

Interhybritizer wrote:I feel bad for Massa though, he's not the one to make those kinds of mistakes. Sadly, the price you have to pay is gargantual even for the tiniest mistakes when you're in Monaco.

According to Ferrari it was a suspension failure :/

Ruben · Post by **Ruben** » 30 May 2013, 18:49

Pawq wrote:
Interhybritizer wrote:I feel bad for Massa though, he's not the one to make those kinds of mistakes. Sadly, the price you have to pay is gargantual even for the tiniest mistakes when you're in Monaco.
According to Ferrari it was a suspension failure :/

Yeah, but only the second time. The failure was supposedly caused by the initial crash in the practice sessions (which was a driver error). In other words; they hadn't had the time to fix the car properly before the race, and the poor guy hits the wall. Again.

Tigro · Post by **Tigro** » 9 Jun 2013, 20:44

Very good race, really enjoyed it. Alonso great job, Massa managed to get some places as well, Ferrari showed very good runs. Vettel best as always (!), McLaren failed pretty hard...

And when I seen Live timing i was just ROFL, only 4 ppl didnt get overtaken over 1 Lap, and Rosberg was just-just at the edge of 1m17s.

Lousku · Post by **Lousku** » 9 Jun 2013, 20:54

Do rockets work here?

pawq · Post by **pawq** » 9 Jun 2013, 21:09

At Monaco last year (or 2 years ago?) it was funny too, like top3 within 3sec and then everyone else lapped or sth.

Good race =)

Chris · Post by **Chris** » 9 Jun 2013, 21:40

Ferrari is total rubbish in wet, like Lotus. Alonso lost a lot of time starting 6th, although I'm not sure if he had pace to challenge Vettel even starting from front row. I wonder if this is again Alonso vs Vettel season. I'm not sure if Lotus can maintain their pace from Spain etc.