+stini +enigma

Lukazz

Zweq wrote:enigma nonbug limit is around 19.4x, 19.5x and that's being 0.2 ahead of stini rec, assuming bugbounce was unintended and 'normal' bounce intended.

wat? i don't see any bugs here http://up.k10x.net/jetszenicghju/47mi1914SL.rec

Zweq

enigma nonbug limit is around 19.4x, 19.5x and that's being 0.2 ahead of stini rec, assuming bugbounce was unintended and 'normal' bounce intended.

Grace

Alright well, here: On reproducability: The bounce is entirely reproducable. On legitimacy: I personally think the replay is legitimate, but most people don't. However, i note here that Thunder's bounce had no bug in it, got a faster bounce and ended at 19.16 as well. On mathematics: Maybe if there ...

anonymous32

Igge wrote:Boy, do you try hard to sound smart.

Igge, perhaps you are right, and I actually am trying hard to sound smart. However, to move it towards you, why would you not, just for once in this topic, put some effort into sounding relevant?

anonymous32

We can go ahead and throw definitions behind it, but if they decide on friday "lol the queen and her family actually has no royal blood at all roflcakes" they aren't going to chuck her out at the age of oldasfuck. I get what you are meaning, Haruhi. You may agree with me, though, that, at...

Grace

The fact remains that we've had this conversation ~10000 times in the past, getting less and less frequent as time as gone on, and here is how the polls have ended throughout time: it's a bug, remove teh: 0 wins it's a bug, leave teh: 9001 wins it's no bug, fuck you bro: 999 wins We can go ahead and...

Igge

Boy, do you try hard to sound smart.

anonymous32

It must be kept in mind though that, to date, 70% of voters have considered the bounce as "illegit."

It would be nice if some of them could explain the reasons they have considered it as, let it be put that way, "flunking admissibility."

Grace

Stini's rec is reproducable.

anonymous32

I suggest that what should be considered legit is what could be considered with technique "reproducible."

klisse

What about levels like Animal Farm, Shelf Life, Sink where wheels squeezes into small areas, isn't that the same as bug bug-bounce? Why should they be legit?

Zweq

well like sveinr implied, bug is an unintended feature, that's the very definition. Bounces were apparently intended for elma, but the ones that give wheel some weird reactions were not. It doesn't matter if that reaction is small or big, it's still a bug (even if it's weaker than "intended bou...

pawq

christ, I expressed that idea ages ago, in various forms, including comparisons of energy... nobody seemed to care :/

totem

isn't it possible to represent a bounce as an acceleration graph ? it would be interesting to see each rec's curve;

and maybe after many deliberations determine a value afterwhich a bounce is considered as a bug. or not.

anonymous32

That, or the unintended (although fortunate) result springing from the common physical model from which both Across and Elma were built.

I get the point you are making, though. All might be a matter of perspective. It is hard for me to form an opinion considering what you are bringing.

All bounces were (fortunate) bugs in Across. In Elma however, Balazs deliberately did not remove bounces because of the great gameplay effects they gave, hence they should no longer be considered bugs. Likewise with the supervolt.

Zweq

Certain type of bounces are prone to bugs, these occur in bowling, enigma, hang tight to name a few. However, many type of bounces aren't bugs ... to decide what's a legit amount of velocity gained from a bounce. Stini's record was accepted by px and that's it, what we should discuss about ...

Grace

Then why the focus on stini's enigma, why not ALL enigma wrs with bounces, all lab pro and bowling, all labyrinth, all hifly?

anonymous32

... favor of future record-table legitness. as a follow-up to "cancel stini's enigma wr?" topic -- just give me the wr) http://elma.oktobia.org/recsource/download.php?rec=535 ...

anonymous32

... to quit (the forums) I am killing my account. When I saw the "Stini Enigma" topic, I was urged to take position, so I created a new one. EDIT: Sorry that ...

Lukazz

Zweq wrote:just give me the wr) http://elma.oktobia.org/recsource/download.php?rec=535

seems legit, let's do it

Zweq

just give me the wr) http://elma.oktobia.org/recsource/download.php?rec=535

Lukazz

probably because prodigy's run is buggy too.

Mats

I've always thought of the Enigma bounce legit, because anyone can do it. Can't say it's just luck, it's hoylable. It's just how you bounce at the right angle with much speed. If you merge the replay with any other, you'll see it's the ...

pawq

maybe you're right, but it's more complicated than it seems. neglecting the fact that (according to mila) its impsy to accurately measure speed from a replay, some speed is also lost during the bounce (braking, throttling etc)

Lousku

Isn't it simple? If more speed after bounce than before, shouldn't be accepted. Pop shouldn't matter, because that happens every other run in any level with low fps.

Edit: if I'm wrong, explain why.

Kopaka

... should be defined as a bug I really don't know. However I've often used stini's enigma as the reference for what is legal. Like for replays on kopasite, if they were more ...

Lousku

Let's just all play flagtag.

Bismuth

We could have attributed the WR to Thunder when he drove 19.16 himself. But then again, some were saying the rec was buggy too, so where to draw the line? Keep it, when it's beaten, celebrate and love Stini.

anonymous32

I'm sure there was a serious discussion about the rec when Stini sent it. There was none -- I know, as I was around and aware. And no, it is not too late for it to be removed from the table. Just regress to Zweq's 19,61 from #174 -- poor Zweq, let the ...

milagros

wtf, ez 17,0x

Kortsu

It won't be taken off the table, simple as that. I'm sure there was a serious discussion about the rec when Stini sent it, but it's just too late to make any changes. Look at it this way, the kuski who beats the time without a bug bounce or S/L will become a legend, rated slightly ...

culinko

it can be beaten without a bug, but i guess it's the only exception on the WR list (maybe the miniwheelpop in ft is considered as bug too?). just leave it there, but don't accept such things in future, imho.

roope

Imo it should've been done earlier if at all. Now it's become a kind of legend, it's the exception that proves the rule.

badyl

The rec is spread and undoubletely there is a bug bounce. Propably it can't be beaten without another bug. Shouldn't wrs be free of such flaws? EDQ is coming and the question seems important.

pawq

... recs and for example set the "legit" boundary 1 unit above Stini's Enigma bounce (if it had been on the table for so long - i think there is no need to explain ...

nick-o-matic

milagros wrote:b) bounces should have no pop and the strength was limited to "certain" value - some may find some bounces buggy:/

Comparing to Stini's Enigma bounce what is this value?

milagros

i would be for 2 years... it's really rare any wr stays that long (except stini's enigma atm) in the table

masterBurn

Hello, hello, hello,

Concerning the acceptability of bounces: is there any objective criteria to be developed?

Like velocity conservation or something?

mila, kopaka, smibu -- have something to say about that?

N.B.: obvious implications, such Stini's Enigma, for example.

Grace

I am slower off the line in any simple acceleration start due to fps i guess. If i merge stini's rec with mine on enigma, he reach the first bump before i do, no matter what i do.

John

More buggy than Stini's yet Stini is the one taking all the shit ;( Well, quite obvious isn't it? I mean ... fukk if Thunder's time is buggish or nat as long as he beats Stini. If one is to beat Enigma WR legally he should at least reach bouncepart faster than Stini does.

Bismuth

... believe it should be changed. I think we should say "Awesome rec, Stini, but sorry, there was a bug" and remove his time from the table. ... go nab. Pipe 28.xx with bug bounce impsy to beat without max luck, Enigma some 19.0x with super-bug time, etc. My opinion is: remove that 19.16 ...

Morgan

Best Players: 47 - Enigma ------------------------------- 1. Stini [ICE] 19,16 2. proDigy [xXx] 19,25 3. Luther [ICE] 19,29 4. TorInge [ICE] 19,40 5. John [WNO] 19,48 5. ...

Raven

... 44,39 30 - Pipe ------------------------------- 1. Tm [TEM] 32,90 2. Stini [ICE] 32,98 3. Kuper [RET] 33,06 4. John [WNO] 33,07 5. Raven [EPO] ... 8. Lukazz [<3] 55,56 9. talli [EPO] 55,56 10. Mika [27] 55,60 47 - Enigma ------------------------------- 1. Stini [ICE] 19,16 2. Thunder 19,16 ...

Thunder

I think stini bounce is one of the best WR in the table... If you look at the run its is so clean and pro... Many other could do the same or even better if they tried to take World record... Im trying to do a bug bounce like talli ...

Bismuth

zweq 8O You could do it. And for that "no offence stini", he does want that time to go too since it was a bug and he is tired of the "legal or nat" debate over the years, as he told me: I don't mind, my elma days are pretty much ...

Memphis

zweq already post the time somewhere and I just missed it? I don't care who does it I would just like to see that time beaten. No offence stini. Keep going thunder and zweq if you guys haven't beaten it.

Zweq

... was done only twice (pipe lev and ff) there's also this fairy tale that stini made 19.4x or such to enigma when wr was 19.62 but comp fucked up, restarted and some recovery thingie on startup ...

anpdad

... are both buggy as hell". And i don't want to see neither this nor stini's bounce on the wr table. Personally, i hate enigma and px's politics about accepting bugbounces, so i really don't know what to suggest ...

Madness

I think that's less bugy than Stini's wr, though a bit faster. Stini's bounce is strange. Go for WR !

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