I have insider information regarding Elasto Mania

General discussion about the games and the scene.

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Post by SveinR » 17 Sep 2004, 18:15

Clearly, the information SlenderBelly is giving us is true. Just look at Abula's posts, hell, simply look at the sincerity of Slender's own posts regarding the issue.

Anyway, it's long past time to stop the constand bickering over SlenderBelly, and instead, perhaps, we could begin discussing this new version of ElastoMania that Balazs is working on.
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Post by Epsilon » 17 Sep 2004, 19:59

if balazs didn't mean that this info will spread, i think we should just wait silently until it comes out and not have a big talk about it.
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Post by Abula » 17 Sep 2004, 20:27

Balá is aware of this thread.
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Post by dz » 18 Sep 2004, 08:21

New version, I'm getting excited!

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Post by MJXII » 21 Sep 2004, 22:57

Hope it works the same on all computers and settings :)

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Post by Juski » 21 Sep 2004, 23:05

I hope not, then there will be no tuning, like profesionals in different sports wasnt allowed to select any of their gear:/ my opinion atleast.
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Post by Kopaka » 22 Sep 2004, 15:30

Does any games work exact the same on all computers/settings ? I guess nat.

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Post by Phillip » 22 Sep 2004, 17:05

Kopaka wrote:Does any games work exact the same on all computers/settings ? I guess nat.
It is possible to make a game's physics independent of framerate, but this is not the usual way to do it. Usually you do a certain number of physics updates per frame, which makes the result dependant on framerate (the result of a numerical integration depends on the length of the "steps").

The frame rate independant way to do it is certainly possible, you just decide on a certain integration step length. (You would of course have to delay each update to make sure the game runs at the correct speed)

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Post by SpeaK » 22 Sep 2004, 17:12

Well Philip, Elma IS independent of framerate. There are other factors than just framerate.

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Post by Phillip » 23 Sep 2004, 15:36

SpeaK, what other factors are those? (Out of curiosity I would like to know)

What I mean is: When testing auto-play levels, the bike ends up differently on different rides (without pressing any keys). What other factors could there possibly be than small variations in the integral steps?

I am aware that you can adjust the physics updating according to framerate so the physics engine runs approximately the same on every machine, but there could still be small variations in timesteps along the ride.

Another thing: turning vsync on and off changes framerate, and also changes (IMO) the behaviour of the bike. If this is right then the elma physics must be dependant on framerate.

Recently I made a small flight simulator that has the same behaviour: I made the game engine update the physics 10 times every frame. (A smarter way would be to check framerate first, and then do less physics updates if framerate was good enough)

When I turned vsync off framerate went from 85 to 450, and the plane acted very differently. (this is also expected from the equations)

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Post by chux » 26 Sep 2004, 21:57

Nat teh expert, but if the bike is different when you turn vsync on and off then surely its not about framerate so much as vertical syncronization? :roll:
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Post by Stini » 27 Sep 2004, 11:13

chux wrote:Nat teh expert, but if the bike is different when you turn vsync on and off then surely its not about framerate so much as vertical syncronization? :roll:
Well, my framerate is over 400 with vsync off and maybe something like 80 with on, so vsync affects dramatically the framerate.

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Post by chux » 27 Sep 2004, 13:53

Hmm, fair enough.
Something Ive never totally understood about framerate - if we see in 24 fps, surely everything above that is pointless...?
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Post by Phillip » 27 Sep 2004, 14:06

chux wrote:Hmm, fair enough.
Something Ive never totally understood about framerate - if we see in 24 fps, surely everything above that is pointless...?
On a tv everything above 24 fps is pointless, because the TV-images automatically contain motion blur. On a computer screen, however, it's different, because games usually don't create images that are blurred.

If a bird flies across the screen on a tv and you freeze the image, you see a long blurred bird. In real life, "framerate" is approximately infinite, and your eyes/brain "creates" this motion blur.

On a computer however you need a lot more fps for the eye to create a realistic motion blur. If you have like 100 fps, the eye cathes 4 frames at a time, which means what you really see each moment is 4 birds next to each other. If it had been like real life or a good tv, it should have been one long blurred bird.

In theory, if a computer game creates perfect motion blur 24-25 fps should be enough for it to look realistic...

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Post by chux » 1 Oct 2004, 14:23

Hmm, makes sense. I thought itd just be cos if you got the timing of the 24 fps slightly off then we'd see it all jerky :D
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Post by chux » 15 Mar 2005, 19:10

chux wrote:Ok, so he posted his first thing on the 7th of September, then said we'll all know in half a year.
So if we dont hear anything by the 7th of March, then we'll all know for sure (yeah yeah, "as if we dont already") that hes full of shiat.
Well, ok, lets give him a bit of room, games often get pushed back, so how about 7th of April?
Ooh, according to SlenderBelly, Elma 2 is out :P
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Post by Wezz » 15 Mar 2005, 19:39

Well, according to Santo (Daniel) ´s talk on elastomaniac i guess i know whats teh secret iz! Well, i havent read all posts, so maybe thiz ez mentioned, but i guess Balazs said that soon, Elma 2 will be published!
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Post by teajay » 15 Mar 2005, 21:04

compared to the time until the sun has burned down, it might be very soon, yes.

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Post by Xiphias » 15 Mar 2005, 21:12

Well maybe this is just a veeeeery slow 1. April joke.
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Post by Wezz » 16 Mar 2005, 09:43

I guess not actually...On elastomaniac, he made a topic for a long time ago named "Elma 2 will come out soon!!!" or something, and there is what...10 pages now? And......I still dont really believe in this, but when he then writes he have insider information, and he wrote it here, it cant be other stuff than this! If u want teh link to teh thread, it ez here:
http://www.elastomaniac.com/showthread.php?t=691

Ive never really believed in it, but u know what? Maybe it EZ right....I really hope nat by teh way!
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Post by Abula » 16 Mar 2005, 18:14

You think it's more true when more people have replied to that topic? Daniel got exactly the same info that everybody else who mailed Balázs back then. I have some Elma knowledge and humble forecast of mine is that Elma 2 won't be published in a year, at least.
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Post by Wezz » 16 Mar 2005, 19:40

Great! That was what i hoped! I just had this feeling, since he wrote it all teh time....
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Post by chux » 20 Mar 2005, 20:18

Abula wrote:You think it's more true when more people have replied to that topic? Daniel got exactly the same info that everybody else who mailed Balázs back then. I have some Elma knowledge and humble forecast of mine is that Elma 2 won't be published in a year, at least.
I be teh n00b, but what was the information Balazs told everyone? :?
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Post by teajay » 20 Mar 2005, 21:49

Send him an email about the next version, and get it yourself. :P

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Post by Kopaka » 21 Mar 2005, 10:14

chux: you can see the email somewhere in this topic.

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