World Cup 5 - Level Quality Discussion

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World Cup 5 - Level Quality Discussion

Post by dz » 3 May 2005, 20:12

People always talk about how bad levels that wcup had and how great levels another wcup had, so this time lets review each of the levels when they are released, it's interesting to see what people think about the levels as so many are playing them.

What do you think the first level by MP?

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Post by Jeppe » 3 May 2005, 20:13

Great level o_O

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Post by Jake » 3 May 2005, 20:15

very höylable
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Post by sierra » 3 May 2005, 20:16

i find it very hard level, not fun to play, with pretty mongo end

maybe i'd enjoy it more if i knew a good style
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Post by Maala » 3 May 2005, 20:17

Great level with great styles, but when u get into the höyling phase it's a little boring... but it's a GOOD lev :D
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Post by Wezz » 3 May 2005, 20:19

I think its a very höylable level..! Especially teh first part of teh around 3 parts teh lev is i think, is very höylable! Looking away from graphics, teh lev is great afterall. Ive found a lot of styles, and that is also a important fact of a WCup level.
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Post by Fanatico » 3 May 2005, 20:20

Indeed very nice lev, hopefully we (EPO) have some styles still to be discovered otherwise höyling gets boring soon..


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Post by dz » 3 May 2005, 20:20

My feelings of playability is rather not so good yet, two specific styles I've been trying to do happens to have alot with luck, and when successing in a level requires alot of luck, meaning tricks which require luck, I can't enjoy that much playing it. Of course every level has things which require more or less luck and some of them might turn out more skill requiring than luck after a long perioid of training. Maybe this one will also.

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Post by zworqy » 3 May 2005, 21:30

I think people automatically love the level(s) just because it's a world cup level... :?
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Post by Xiphias » 3 May 2005, 21:30

Really like this lvl. Great work MP :D
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Post by ead » 3 May 2005, 22:15

my humble noob opinion ( :roll: ) , its a good level and seems to me there are some neat tricks hidden in it, i just cant seem to do them =X so to a newb like me, it seems like sort of a boring level =( still i like it though
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Post by Xhomaz » 3 May 2005, 23:22

My first impression of this level was not good at all. I tend to look a lot at the esthetic part, and found that to be quite bad. I Also thought, "hmm wasn't this mp's level, and he did ALP levels?". Found this one not as good as ALP. Also, the faster routes in the level was too hard.

But after a while, when I got a quicker style I liked it a lot better. Some parts are as dz said, a little luck required, which is sad, but some parts are fun to play. The amount of routes/styles are few, but still some, and thats positive.

Conclusion is that this level is better than mediocre, but still not top notch. I miss the grass (which is my love), and the esthetic could be better. But on the other hand, the level is playable, a little of a challenge to do well for me, but its nice afterall.

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Post by Luther » 4 May 2005, 01:30

I love the lev
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Post by Boomer » 4 May 2005, 10:31

Me too =)

Not so much time for this event though. School ends in June :(
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Post by m4rv1n » 4 May 2005, 12:10

i'm confused by this level but i think i'm not good in finding styles or at all too bad :oops: because for me the level is everything else than smooth to drive... :roll:
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Post by Dynamo » 4 May 2005, 12:56

I thought the lev was okay at the start but after I found the under 1 min style (funnest style ever) its become one of the best externals ive played...im not much of a picture critiquer neways :wink:
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Post by Pertti » 4 May 2005, 17:06

Hm, pretty cool. At least its nice to cruise it.
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Post by twipley » 4 May 2005, 17:24

When you get the turn at it it's höylable. The styles seemed hard to succeed for me at the beginning, but with time it goes better. It's not hard to miss a part of the level, because as you know some parts are tricky, so you have to replay the first parts again. Some tricky moves, fun to do, but the beginning gets annoying with the time.

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Post by 8-ball » 4 May 2005, 22:52

At first it seemed okiz lev. But with time it became awesome. The luck part does ruin the playability a bit cause you have to replay the start again and again. But again - very hoylable. Design is as it has to be for a framework level. Who would need 0.01mm grass? Good work. 4.2/5.0
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Post by Xhomaz » 5 May 2005, 10:32

I forgot to comment on the length of the level, which I think is ok. Maybe a bit too long actually. I usually like the short ones best (30-45secs), because my skills aren't good enough to drive well without mistakes on a longer level. (Requires lot of playing). But the length is nice.. But when we get levels over 1,5 mins, I may give in...
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Post by Ky.Jelly » 5 May 2005, 12:51

its ok until some stupid fack put this gay arse hill in the damn middle :P, nah level is good, cheers MP
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Post by px » 5 May 2005, 13:41

Xhomaz wrote:I usually like the short ones best (30-45secs)
I don't have enough of levels of this length, please send me more, all of you. Thanks.
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Post by MP » 5 May 2005, 19:25

Good topic dz, it's really nice to read these short reviews about the level. I agree with many of your comments. I personally have struggled quite much with this level and I know what you mean by those lucky parts ..I can assure you I didn't plan it to be like that when I made this but didn't bother to do max testplay höyling. It's not an unusual situation that new styles pop up once you spend more time with the level.

About the outlook, missing grass seems to bother few of you. I try to have some variation when I do levels so all of them doesn't look exactly the same. Even though this kinda framework structure isn't a new thing (and yes it's different kind than in internals) I haven't done a lev like this before. In past wcups there has been similar though. One level that I sent in doesn't have grass at all, and there is no fancy details either ..it's max ugly and supposed to be so heah ;)
zworqy wrote:I think people automatically love the level(s) just because it's a world cup level...
If you look at the past it's been almost completely other way around, not that I'm an old wcup veteran but it seems like a tradition to say the lev sux even before downloading ;). I think that in big competitions like wcup where you play pretty much the peoples opinion really diverse. Either you get really frustrated with some trick for instance and start to hate the level or then you do good and think the levels is great. Of course there is still people who don't have that strong opinion, they are the ones who just chill and cruise around.


what a long post phew but anyway thnx for the nice feedback
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Post by Buka-VET » 6 May 2005, 21:32

That lev, IMHO for newbie too hard just to ride it... but it's not bad at all :wink:

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Post by The_BoneLESS » 6 May 2005, 22:04

WCup501 Ladies like MP

Playability : 9.2 / 10


Nice level you got there. The first part of the level is pretty neat. Various styles for every type of players but the better you are, the most advance tricks you can do. Nice little tricks. Then, the second part is pretty neat, two main styles are possible but, they mostly give the same results. Then, the ending. Three major styles are possible but the best one is the most obvious. Everyone by seing the level can pretty much guess the winning style but not everyone can execute it perfectly. Too bad that some tricks requires a part of luck. The level is tight and firmly deserves to be part of the WCup5.

Visually : 7.5 / 10

Hummm, the level is visually ok, but I wouldn't give an award to MP for the design of the level. The start and the ending aren't grass and are masked with this bright brick red color. Nothing more annoying than this color. At least, MP put some grass and different colors in the middle part so, you don't get too annoyed by the red. Beside that, the kinda frame design i okay, almost beautiful...! But I don't really care about the visual because it is a World Cup level and nobody cares about the appearance of a WC level...

Overall : 8.8 / 10

The level is very fun to play if it wasn't for a certain bounce which is killing me for now but, if you put aside my lack of skills, the level is great for a world cup...

Best time : around 56 but i'll get better !

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Post by dz » 11 May 2005, 16:47

Event 2 by Rasken,

well I've played it now for some time and I got to say that the idea is great along with the outlook but as sad as it sounds, there is hardly any enjoying loop level existing. So what I'm saying is that I like the looks but I don't like the feeling. I just hate playing this level because it's really annoying to play.

But still I think it's a good choice to world cup, for some reason. The fact that px is not afraid to take risks and put different kind of events and different kind of levels is at the same time really exciting and somewhat scary too. :P

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Post by MP » 11 May 2005, 17:10

dz has many good points there. Even though I'm not a fan of this level I somehow like the way px chooses levels.

Short review of teh event02:

You can see that rasken has made levels before. The outlook is pretty regular in a good way, that makes it a bit boring too because the grass and pics seems so normal. I don't really like the symmetricy, especially when it comes with this loopy form. Good thing is that you don't have to repeat the parts twice.

At first this seemed like totally shiath but it's gotten a bit better since. I don't usually judge levels but the loops and narrow tunnels together really doesn't fit my idea of coalz höyling. Style finding is usually my favourite part but now even that didn't feel that nice. Now with this 4x style the lev seems also quite höylä, don't like that either.

I think this level would suit best in some random external competition, but still there is something wcup'ish too, maybe would be better event for the later rounds dunno
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Post by zworqy » 11 May 2005, 20:04

Wcup502 is crap.
<Fihlvein> another case of zworqy-is-always-right closed i guess
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Post by wjelo » 11 May 2005, 21:37

i think wc5 levels sux (till now) first maybe waz good but only for advanced kuskis and 2nd sux hard :-) daisy cup had better levels :D
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Post by Memphis » 11 May 2005, 22:13

I couldn't agree more with dz. he hit the nail on the button. It's like he stole the words out of my mouth. lvl kinda sux but i think it almost has to be in world cup 5. good analagy dz keep em coming.

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Post by The_BoneLESS » 12 May 2005, 00:40

WCup502 Wheel Rim by Rasken

Playability : 6.5 / 10


At first, you have to hate the level; a kinda loop symetrical level...i have chills just by thinking about it. But, that is a kind of transitory phase because, after playing for like an hour, you start to find some ok styles and maybe start liking the level a little. Then, you go on IRC and R***i and J***e upload publically two recs showing two sucky runs with a nice trick in each which helps a lot to love the level. The level itself is not the best but, there are some seriously hard tricks to pull for sure. After some hours of playing, it may become annoying to make the stupid uphill part every freakin' time but still, not a 'that' bad level.

Visually : 8 / 10

The level looks a little better than MP's level but, it's not the 'best looking level in the whole world'. Not much to say. Grass is good, colors are nice. Pretty basic one. Nothing to jump off your chair.

Overall : 6.9 / 10

Not the best level I ever saw but, WCup really needs those kinds of levels to bother the spirits of some players. Doesn't deserve a bad rating...

Best time : some 47;some for now...

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Post by ead » 12 May 2005, 00:56

i was planning a level somethign like this with pipes in the center.. itd be pretty lame to make it now :( but since this levels almost like mine (weird huh :D), i have to think its good :lol: these levels are hard for noobs to find styles in it seems.. we're not in contention at all 8)
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Post by Crazy » 12 May 2005, 08:23

Just one question, does looks matter at all?

When I play, the only thing that matters is playability. I have turned off all graphics and animated stuff and just play the raw material. Of course, I have to admit that a nice grass lev (I sometimes play with grass to see how a lev looks) is ok but after a while all pics just give me headache.
Only thing which might be annoying is like max ugly textures/ backgrounds when I play. All other levs are equally nice imo.

eh, so when I find a really nice lev, which I like to höyl, then it happens that I check how the lev really looks but that's very rare.

Sum up: I'm a mongo :S but I like this lev because of the playability!
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Post by Kopaka » 12 May 2005, 09:35

I really like it, so many styles, took really long time to find the best style. ye it was weird in the begnining...

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Post by dz » 12 May 2005, 09:50

Kopaka wrote:I really like it, so many styles, took really long time to find the best style. ye it was weird in the begnining...
nobody knows the best style! :?

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Post by sierra » 12 May 2005, 09:50

in some ways i guess it's the mark of a good level if it grows on you with time. which this level has done. every style i've played, and i've alternated between many, has made it slowly but surely less mongo and more hoylable, which is quite coal
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Post by Kopaka » 12 May 2005, 15:56

dz wrote:
Kopaka wrote:I really like it, so many styles, took really long time to find the best style. ye it was weird in the begnining...
nobody knows the best style! :?
I do, sorry I can't give to you FM guys (team politics) ;) ;)

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Post by Juble » 15 May 2005, 14:26

event 3a is the worst level Ive ever laid eyes on...

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Post by Rez » 15 May 2005, 14:29

i like this one. only the visual style is not so good
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Post by sierra » 15 May 2005, 14:34

seems quite mango
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Post by zworqy » 15 May 2005, 14:35

MAX LEVEL!!!
<Fihlvein> another case of zworqy-is-always-right closed i guess
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Post by Ramone » 15 May 2005, 14:37

thanks for all the nice words.. .I realyl like the level too :D
especially the nice and original bricked frames... I really wanted to make something new :wink:
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Post by dz » 15 May 2005, 14:42

zworqy wrote:MAX LEVEL!!!
Yeah I'm sure you like it. the difficulty level is just perfect for you this time. :P

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Post by milagros » 15 May 2005, 15:18

[3:40pm] <ciphEM> i vote this is worst wcap level ever
no doubt
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Post by 8-ball » 15 May 2005, 15:50

It's too painful to talk about this piece'o'youknowwhat :?
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Post by zworqy » 15 May 2005, 16:35

dz wrote:
zworqy wrote:MAX LEVEL!!!
Yeah I'm sure you like it. the difficulty level is just perfect for you this time. :P
fakc yuo :P

Difficulty has nothing with level quality to do.
<Fihlvein> another case of zworqy-is-always-right closed i guess
<yoosef> zworqy doesnt suck at anything

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Post by MP » 15 May 2005, 16:39

Have to think of the bright side, this is probably the worst level which is going to be in this wcup and it's used in this A B thing. Would be good for a 10min battle lev I guess. I don't bother for a longer review this time.
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Post by dz » 15 May 2005, 16:43

Well, it's.... short.

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Post by twipley » 15 May 2005, 19:03

Very cool, but also very short. But I don't play much, so it's perhaps OK for me. I was impressioned by it ! IT's esthetic

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Post by teajay » 15 May 2005, 19:23

You mean you like the outlook?

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