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Post by Sunshine » 10 Feb 2017, 02:25

i started this level as a battle that i had submitted for wcup but changed my mind and rather have it as part of my J2BA pack and got a 2 week ban (it said "reason: starting a wcup level" topkek) wtf? as far as im concerned its my level and i can do anything i want with it and submitting alone doesnt disqualify level from being battled as many people start cup levels etc that have not been picked for a particular cup as battles and obviously this is a good thing. if my ban is not removed i will never start another level ever again.
Last edited by Sunshine on 21 Nov 2017, 15:35, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by roope » 10 Feb 2017, 02:49

What if it had gone unnoticed and we would have used it in the cup (as we would have)? I seriously doubt you would have bothered to tell us that you battled it. Yes, it's your lev, but it's also simply a shitty thing to do and puts us in a tight spot since now we have little time to find a replacement lev for the first event. While there is no written rule for it, I do think that if you send a lev to a cup it means the lev is committed to the cup until a) you're told that the lev isn't going to be used or b) the cup is over.

Here's more context to those who weren't there:
1. there was some irc commotion where ville_j basically told Jappe that he was a shitty mod
2. Kopaka agreed
3. Jappe apparently got butthurt and started the wcup lev, because "i rather have it associated with my levpack then anything kopaka is part of"
4. WCup selector mans said it was uncool and that he wasted our time, to which Jappe kindly replied things like "go fuck yourself retard" and "they are sucking kopakas kugel which i didnt even know is even possible because that man is a walking human pussy"

So while there isn't a written rule about this particular behaviour, I personally have no problems with the start ban to go along with the chat ban because Jappe is a toxic man who does toxic things.
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by jblaze » 10 Feb 2017, 04:24

haha fuck you jappedwa!

keep starting FFs so i can grime them a bit with my tires, but keep your elmouth shut!
keeps on misbehaving, what a bad boy he is, such a noxious person!

come to FEM, would like to talk to you!
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by Labs » 10 Feb 2017, 05:20

Looks nice lev, too bad it wont come with wcup now :(
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by kuchitsu » 10 Feb 2017, 06:38

Insulting the authority is always stupid. When a cop pulls you over you don't tell him to go fuck himself, no matter what his reasoning is.

Lev looks good but I'm afraid there is a mongo shortcut pipe that would piss everyone off. Maybe I'm glad we won't see it in WCup.

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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by iCS » 10 Feb 2017, 09:03

vermin supreme busted, wcup level wasted :(

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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by Lousku » 10 Feb 2017, 09:09

Ok, battling a wcup submission is annoying and that whole drama seemed stupid but I think startban is an overreaction and a bit of mod abuse.
roope wrote:What if it had gone unnoticed and we would have used it in the cup (as we would have)? I seriously doubt you would have bothered to tell us that you battled it.
This part maykes no sense. You were right theer reading #across and he did tell you.

Startban seems like just spiteful and vindictive since he hasn't started any balles against the rules. How does startban fit at all? It's just a slap on the wrist for being rebellious (but not breaking rules). I think this is mod abuse.
then again i don't know anything
maybe easier not to think abouut alöl things thought than not things thought ... or something..=?

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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by iltsu » 10 Feb 2017, 09:58

Agree with lousku

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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by Bjenn » 10 Feb 2017, 10:29

Why is it mod abuse? He totally deserved it. Jappe fool.

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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by Lousku » 10 Feb 2017, 10:37

If you think punishments (like bans) are a way to revenge people for whatever, then it's appropriate.

In my view punishments are prevention of bad behavior (as it is in most civilized countries). Ban obviously prevents someone from doing whatever they were doing (like chatban prevents those insults he was throwing), but having written rules is also prevention ("it says here that if I do this, I will lose these and these rights"). In this case the rule of lev ownership was not written anywhere, nor do I think it was common sense or predictable. Giving startban for it was not prevention, it was vindictive revenge. This is a bad precedent.

In addition to a bad precedent of mod abuse being accepted, it also sucks for the community because now we don't get J2 levs for 2 weeks (or more if this is discouraging).

edit: 2 weeks instead of 1 week
Last edited by Lousku on 10 Feb 2017, 13:51, edited 1 time in total.
then again i don't know anything
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by Zweq » 10 Feb 2017, 10:54

wtF?? this is totaly unaceptable and inapropriate behaviour. 1 year ban MINMIUM

Ceriously though wtf has startban got to do with anything? Even if there was going to be punishment it should be something totally different, like "can't send levels to wcup8" or whatever.
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by ville_j » 10 Feb 2017, 11:13

Well he did start borderline acceptable battle. This can be heavily debatable, but if you would really want to pull your level back from wcup you should ask about it especially now that the cup is starting in a week. It's a really dick move and done on purpose just to fuck with people, this kind of behavior is punishable. Since there aren't clear written rules what happens if you act like a jerk then you can't know what to expect, however it doesn't mean nothing should be done. Startban is related because he did start a borderline battle, I think it is a fair punishment because they had to come up with something to show that this is not ok. Banning level submissions from wcup8 or even all further wcups kinda makes sense, but we don't even know if they are going to happen and a lifetime ban is a bit of a stretch, you get out of jail and free commit same crime again in real life too. In real life you also get a fine from speeding, it doesn't prevent you doing it again at all, it is just a punishment and to remind you that's not acceptable. I can only see this whole thing being fair in this situation, but maybe we need to come up with some written rules on levels sent to wcups because apparently people are being dicks for the sake of it. It really annoys me always when people do borderline stuff and then start to complain when mods take action.
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by Lousku » 10 Feb 2017, 11:34

You're saying something had to be done, but something was done. He got a chatban for insults and trolling, his levs would probably not be accepted into any cups in the future (since this would've been made public knowledge anyway) and people would've seen him in a negative light for this anyway. But this wasn't enough, mod overstepped bounds and now Jappe2 and everyone who plays his balles was made a victim.
In real life you also get a fine from speeding, it doesn't prevent you doing it again at all, it is just a punishment and to remind you that's not acceptable.
Of course it prevents it "at all"! There would be much moar speeding if we didn't hev fines.
then again i don't know anything
maybe easier not to think abouut alöl things thought than not things thought ... or something..=?

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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by Zero » 10 Feb 2017, 11:57

kuchitsu wrote:I'm afraid there is a mongo shortcut pipe that would piss everyone off. Maybe I'm glad we won't see it in WCup.
Yeah.. It would have been used for sure.
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by Ramone » 10 Feb 2017, 12:02

Its fucking obv you dont use levels you sent for wcup. It is a battle that is not allowed. jappe did it just to mess. its extremely lame and jappe have a history of being extremely lame and getting away with it. so ban is normal here. dont see why ppl say dont ban. also, saying it punishes all cause you dont get to play his levels.

well, if that would be the case many "important" ppl shouldnt be punished when misbehaved cause it causes overall greater worse situation. luckily the system doesnt work like that.
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by roope » 10 Feb 2017, 12:07

Lousku wrote:Ok, battling a wcup submission is annoying and that whole drama seemed stupid but I think startban is an overreaction and a bit of mod abuse.
roope wrote:What if it had gone unnoticed and we would have used it in the cup (as we would have)? I seriously doubt you would have bothered to tell us that you battled it.
This part maykes no sense. You were right theer reading #across and he did tell you.
He invited to people to "come play wcup first event" after I told him that we were going to use it.

To people wondering about pipe shortcut: was going to be fixed
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by Hosp » 10 Feb 2017, 13:40

I'm just gonna throw in my two cents (euro cents, don't have dollar cents), since it is his level I think he has every right to do as he wishes with it, however unappropiate/bothersome it may be for organizers.
But I don't get at all why he would think having it in his ballelevel pack would get it more attention or appreciation than if it had been in WORLD CUP, that most everyone is gonna at least check out all the levels. Now he misses out on amazing Kazan replay too.
So probably reason for balling it was to cause some drama imo.
/Hospend

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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by pawq » 10 Feb 2017, 16:15

Ok, firstly, I thought Jappe deserved his ban even after only just reading his post. Then I read the rest of the posts with the context and just thought "lal, mr. dick in action again" in addition to the ban being deserved.

Secondly, I also agree that a startban may not be the most suitable punishment for the situation, because it's not 100000% related, but imo this kind of behaviour should definitely be punished, and what better way is there than to put a short-term ban of actual consequence? Banning anyone from submitting levs to wcup8 is like pulling them over for speeding and saying "hey, if my son joins the police force and pulls you over as well, he'll give you a fine".
Ramone wrote:its extremely lame and jappe have a history of being extremely lame and getting away with it.
(...)
many "important" ppl shouldnt be punished when misbehaved cause it causes overall greater worse situation. luckily the system doesnt work like that.
Exactly. For once I agree with Ram :*

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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by Lousku » 10 Feb 2017, 16:56

Ramone wrote:also, saying it punishes all cause you dont get to play his levels.

well, if that would be the case many "important" ppl shouldnt be punished when misbehaved cause it causes overall greater worse situation. luckily the system doesnt work like that.
That was kinda just a side point, but okay... Startban is unrelated to what he did. Even if he had more levs in wcup to pull back out of spite, he could publish them just as well outside of balles. And there was no way to expect startban to be given, since it wasn't a rule, I don't think it's common sense and it accomplishes nothing but drama.

Kinda sad that many pipel hear seem to be cheering the idea of punishment for the sake of revenge, not prevention.
then again i don't know anything
maybe easier not to think abouut alöl things thought than not things thought ... or something..=?

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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by Hosp » 10 Feb 2017, 17:12

I agre with Loske he always good man
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by sunl » 10 Feb 2017, 17:12

I'm not sure what my opinion is on the actual level ban, but I strongly agree with Lousku that we shouldn't all be cheering the fact that Jappe got a ban because, as Lousku said, people are cheering it for revenge/vindication while I agree with Lousku that the intent of these things should be preventative looking toward the future.

I had submitted a level in January that was said to be unlikely to be taken, and so I battled it and and sent a pm to I think Kopaka saying that I ended up battling the level so disregard it: http://www.recsource.tv/r/quakotbrzi

So clearly there's some sort of gray line when it comes to this and Jappe fell more on the wrong side of the line by starting it after it had already been accepted etc., but I don't think we should all be celebrating because by giving someone a ban we are losing contributions to the community.

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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by Sunshine » 10 Feb 2017, 17:23

good banter guys however my unjust ban still hasnt been removed... wat is dat about?
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by Hosp » 10 Feb 2017, 17:24

leave bjappe al0ne!
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by Lousku » 10 Feb 2017, 17:26

Ehh, I kinda forgot to finish the thought in my last post. =D Here goes.

Even if it's ok to give a random ban for something you deem unacceptable out of common sense, choosing startban was extrabad because it puts him on hiatus from making balles for 2 weeks and that might easily extend for longer, so EOL community takes a blow. And this is an extra reason for my caring.
then again i don't know anything
maybe easier not to think abouut alöl things thought than not things thought ... or something..=?

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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by kuchitsu » 10 Feb 2017, 17:48

Imo starting a wc level is a smaller problem compared to insulting Kopaka. That's not how you treat the essential pillar of the community.

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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by Hosp » 10 Feb 2017, 18:15

Yeah I think the insult was the worst part of teh whole thang. Chatban deserved, rest not-so-much. But if I know Vermin good enough, he'll survive just about anything ye
And, as I said yesterday, inwards fighting in this little scene is not good for us. Let's start a war to crush those X-MOTO mans instead. They need to go down. (Like really wtf play elma instead??)
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by adi » 10 Feb 2017, 18:23

I think small punishment is very fine, because we don't need to tolerate this kind of behavior. And it's not a revenge...just a punishment for very bad behavior. If consequences are that jappe2 won't make more levels...I don't really care. Or should we just accept blackmailing?

Anyway punishment could be much more severe (banning from whole scene for 1-2 weeks, dunno though how pos). Preventing to send levs for wc8 would be a bit meh. Ppl will forget this case in a couple of years. Or how many still remember who did the same thing before wc7 (though probably just due to ignorance).
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by Lousku » 10 Feb 2017, 18:29

adi wrote:And it's not a revenge...just a punishment for very bad behavior.
But revenge is a form of punishment here. The other possibility is prevention, which this is not. All punishment in civilized countries is for the sake of prevention.
then again i don't know anything
maybe easier not to think abouut alöl things thought than not things thought ... or something..=?

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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by Madness » 10 Feb 2017, 20:36

Rules wrote:Starting battles
3.1 Starting a battle on a level that has been battled or otherwise released before
Just be a man and accept your punishment, the rules are clear in this case. Due to the severity of your misdemeanour and the fact that you do not show any remorse for your actions, I suggest extending the ban and some waterboarding.
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by culinko » 10 Feb 2017, 20:56

I'm not taking sides but this is the n-th topic on lauta about mods vs banned person that I've seen. I don't know how often are people banned in eol, but to me it seems like they are getting banned for petty things you can normally solve by talking to them and whatnot.
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by Sunshine » 10 Feb 2017, 21:10

madness are you really that dumb? not used cup levels have been battled forever and no one has complained obviously, if you spend 10 hours on level and it doesnt get selected you should just throw it in the trash? best way to motivate mans to make levels for events for sure
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by roope » 10 Feb 2017, 21:21

culinko wrote:I'm not taking sides but this is the n-th topic on lauta about mods vs banned person that I've seen. I don't know how often are people banned in eol, but to me it seems like they are getting banned for petty things you can normally solve by talking to them and whatnot.
I honestly have bad memory and tried searching for some ban controversies, but didn't really find anything that I couldn't stand behind, so would you like to share some of these cases? (Actually being neutrally curious, not aggressive)
All I know is that during the 2 years I've been a mod, pretty much all of the people who get bans are repeat offenders who will not listen to any normal talk (oh we've tried to the point of frustration); cheaters who keep making phantom accounts, people who keep excessively speaking other languages than English, and people who start battles they know aren't allowed.
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by Kopaka » 10 Feb 2017, 21:27

Lousku wrote:Startban seems like just spiteful and vindictive since he hasn't started any balles against the rules. How does startban fit at all? It's just a slap on the wrist for being rebellious (but not breaking rules). I think this is mod abuse.
A level is either allowed or not allowed to be battled, in most cases it's pretty clear, but there are some edge cases of course. If you look at it only within the confines of EOL, then yeah the start ban doesn't make sense, because it's his level and it's not published. If you look at it in regards to the elma scene as a whole, then the level is temporarily reserved for wcup as long as it's sent for that and wcup isn't over or pickers haven't told otherwise, so it's not okay to battle it. And sure that's not specifically written anywhere, but should be common sense for someone who's been around for a long time. If at this point we could conclude that he understood the error, we could consider removing the ban, because as you say it doesn't make much sense as a preventative measure. But that's not the case. And I'd say the 1 or 2 week bans are more of a warning than a prevention, since they're so short.
culinko wrote:I'm not taking sides but this is the n-th topic on lauta about mods vs banned person that I've seen. I don't know how often are people banned in eol, but to me it seems like they are getting banned for petty things you can normally solve by talking to them and whatnot.
That is very much something we do, talking to people rather than banning straight away. But we need to assess each situation and person. In some cases people are impossible to talk to, so there's no point in trying that (which would be why I'm adressing other people here, not Jappe himself). And in many of these kind of cases, people know very well they are doing something either wrong or directly against rules, in such case I tend to go directly for the ban because there's no point telling them something they already know. We have to make a judgement as to which action is most useful, and sure it's not always correct, but we have a lot of experience in people's behaviour in this scene by now, and I can assure you we don't take it lightly.

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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by Madness » 10 Feb 2017, 22:26

Vermin Supreme wrote:madness are you really that dumb? not used cup levels have been battled forever and no one has complained obviously, if you spend 10 hours on level and it doesnt get selected you should just throw it in the trash? best way to motivate mans to make levels for events for sure
That's not what happened here, is it?
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by Sunshine » 11 Feb 2017, 00:14

you argued i should be banned because of rule 3.1 and that its "clear" which was just dumb of you to say and i shouldnt have to repeat why when i already wrote why cup levels that are not chosen are not considered "released" (and i dont think my level will be chosen for wcup7 anymore sadly!)
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by gimp » 11 Feb 2017, 00:59

Jappe knows he is wrong, he is just arguing for his own amusement. maybe we should extend the ban for our own amusement? and he has said he enjoys being spanked so no harm here, really all good fun
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by Hosp » 11 Feb 2017, 05:42

As I've said before: DESIGNERS LEVELS ARE ALWWAYS THE DESIGNERS LEVELS AND THE CAN CHOOSE TO WATEFERTHEFAK THEY WANT WITH THEIR LEVELS, only thing I thought was unFORGIVABLE by Jappe2 also knows ans VERMINSAN is that he called KOPAKA a pussay walkin in his own flehs an bones, which is not alright considering wat me man KOPAKA has done for the SCENE and CHATBAN him for all I care but LET HIM START BATTLES FOR FUCKKS SAKE OK? I am sent by GOD to make this conflict NOT SHINE OK??!?!? IT's EASY MATES. Let's not overcomplicate this event for the sake of DRAMA OK?? Now do as I SAY and all will be alrite oke????
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by Ramone » 11 Feb 2017, 09:33

If you send a level for world cup it is still your level but it is not your to do with whatever you want. You cant do anything with it before you get told straight out it wont be used, or world cup is over and then you can do whatever you want with it. Jappe knows no one ever said levels that wont get picked will be to waste.

If you write a shortstory and enter a contest with it its is always not allowed to have it published anywhere, not even online. obviously.

Hosp logic is fucking lame. when you send it for wc you give up that right of "ownership"

if you draw a painting and sell it its your painting, you can just go homem to buyer and take it from wall and say: "I painted this so I do whatefak I want with it"

Why is this even an argument? Like, really?

We should stop talking this, only feeds Jappe.
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by Sunshine » 11 Feb 2017, 15:29

my unjust ban is still in effect, it should be removed today or tomorrow
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by jblaze » 11 Feb 2017, 16:10

what you did in the days of your power strikes back!
fuck you still and stop crying your pants off :beer:
and no, my first post was not a threat, would really like to talk with jappe (in a calm way, ofc) and hear reasons behind abreacting personal stuff this way. im no psychiatrist but i sometimes feel a need to cure ppl from wrong way of thinking, i even sometimes do it without them knowing it. GG stay strong guys
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by Orcc » 11 Feb 2017, 19:25

However annoying thing starting the lev as battle was, I don't see it breaking any firm rules.

I was chosen to a new job two months ago and one week before I was supposed to start I got a better offer from my previous company and decided to stay. The new company's CEO wasn't very happy about it, but I had all the rights to do so. I kinda see this as a similar situation: unless it was stated somewhere that submitted levs will remain world cup's property until the cup is over I don't see it as punishable offense. Level creator is free to change his mind. Just like if you enter a writing competition and publish it elsewhere, it will only result in your publication being removed from the competition.
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by culinko » 11 Feb 2017, 20:23

roope wrote:I honestly have bad memory and tried searching for some ban controversies, but didn't really find anything that I couldn't stand behind, so would you like to share some of these cases? (Actually being neutrally curious, not aggressive)
Not sure why do you have to clarify that, your post doesn't look aggressive at all.

I might have remembered things wrong and I guess it was more about mod abuse than bans. I just remember there have been some heated discussions in the past, listing the ones I have found with search:

http://mopolauta.moposite.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=8808 (the TL ban, not the only topic about that)
http://mopolauta.moposite.com/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=8634 (people talking about ban abuse)
http://mopolauta.moposite.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=9440 (aborting of battles)
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by roope » 11 Feb 2017, 22:33

culinko wrote:
roope wrote:I honestly have bad memory and tried searching for some ban controversies, but didn't really find anything that I couldn't stand behind, so would you like to share some of these cases? (Actually being neutrally curious, not aggressive)
Not sure why do you have to clarify that, your post doesn't look aggressive at all.

I might have remembered things wrong and I guess it was more about mod abuse than bans. I just remember there have been some heated discussions in the past, listing the ones I have found with search:

http://mopolauta.moposite.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=8808 (the TL ban, not the only topic about that)
http://mopolauta.moposite.com/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=8634 (people talking about ban abuse)
http://mopolauta.moposite.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=9440 (aborting of battles)
Thanks. Some short comments about those without continuing too much offtopic:
-First topic, TL is one of those repeat offenders that I mentioned earlier, doesn't listen to anything and knows he's breaking rules. He's calmed down a bit recently though
-Second topic is 5 year old topic and it's ironically about Jappe being a nazi mod which pretty much everyone agreed with - he's not a mod anymore, not much to be said there
-Third topic is a bit harder one. It's easier to make mistakes when aborting since it's hard to judge what is actually impsy and what's not - also IIRC there's a guideline that a battle can be abortable if there's a huge mismatch in battle time vs. lev, like 60 minute battle in a 5s straight flat lev, so in some cases it's hard to define the limit. Sometimes many people scream for abort and mod (or someone else who has abort rights) has to make a relatively quick decision about the lev and sometimes it goes wrong. That being said, I also agree that in that case Labs simply did the wrong decision and I think it wasn't just a simple mistake, and to be honest Labs isn't the kind of person I would have personally chosen to be a mod
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by Sunshine » 12 Feb 2017, 00:08

hope you stick to your word and quit like you said you would
Last edited by Sunshine on 21 Nov 2017, 15:37, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by Labs » 12 Feb 2017, 00:37

I also agree that in that case Labs simply did the wrong decision and I think it wasn't just a simple mistake, and to be honest Labs isn't the kind of person I would have personally chosen to be a mod
So i did it on purpose to fuck up the ppl? Or what do you think? One bad decision and you already say, im not the one who should be mod anymore, funny. If this counts to be abusive, yes im abusive. Also i have nothing to do with Jappe's ban, leave me alone, thanks.
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by roope » 12 Feb 2017, 00:58

Labs wrote:
I also agree that in that case Labs simply did the wrong decision and I think it wasn't just a simple mistake, and to be honest Labs isn't the kind of person I would have personally chosen to be a mod
So i did it on purpose to fuck up the ppl? Or what do you think? One bad decision and you already say, im not the one who should be mod anymore, funny. If this counts to be abusive, yes im abusive. Also i have nothing to do with Jappe's ban, leave me alone, thanks.
It was just a personal note to clear up misunderstandings of mod abuse, saying that I don't always mindlessly approve of all mod behaviour either (because of implications that all mods just stand behind each other's backs simply because they're mods). It wasn't just that case, just saying that because I don't think you're showing a very good example to people (like I think a mod should) because you're always so negative - to the point that it wouldn't surprise me that your Bjenn battle abortion had questionable motives.
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by Labs » 12 Feb 2017, 01:45

to the point that it wouldn't surprise me that your Bjenn battle abortion had questionable motives.
From Bjenn:
Hello, I thought that my 30 min battle got aborted, because there was no winrec on recsource.
I wrote this also in first post but removed it when I realized thanks to Markku that the winrec was just not uploaded yet.
I'm not negative, just realistic, maybe its close to eachother. The one was aborted was from chris anyway (maybe i hate him too, also everyone... nope). Actually i dont have troubles with bjenn even.
Last edited by Labs on 12 Feb 2017, 01:59, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by roope » 12 Feb 2017, 01:51

I stand corrected - I skimmed through the topic quickly and didn't notice that post.
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by Sunshine » 12 Feb 2017, 05:40

my last post may have been overly harsh, i dont wish you quit but i still hate you for the time being
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Re: Got a two week startban for starting my own level

Post by ofta » 12 Feb 2017, 15:38

sad topic. imo this is like 10% about elma/wcup and 90% about guys bullying other guys for whatever reasons with either aggression or passive aggression. just chill maybe?

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