GAA suggestions thread 2018

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Re: GAA suggestions thread 2018

Post by bene » 22 Jul 2018, 12:01

I nominate bene for everything because :bear:
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Re: GAA suggestions thread 2018

Post by pawq » 22 Jul 2018, 12:49

Hosp wrote:
22 Jul 2018, 11:24
Very agree with Haruhi, Markku Father of Eol imo)
So much yes. Don't have time to write more, but Markku is like the holy saint of the elma community, and at the same time the chief librarian, the father, the headmaster, and one of the biggest pros. Hats off M :beer: (and thanks for the ride to Vammala :wink: )

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Re: GAA suggestions thread 2018

Post by Lousku » 22 Jul 2018, 18:55

Thank you Grace, very goodly written, completely agree with everything there. Markku is irreplaceable and amazing.
then again i don't know anything
maybe easier not to think abouut alöl things thought than not things thought ... or something..=?

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Re: GAA suggestions thread 2018

Post by Lukazz » 25 Jul 2018, 23:26

Designer: danitah
Many rememberable battle levels lately.
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Re: GAA suggestions thread 2018

Post by umiz » 28 Jul 2018, 11:42

Designer: danitah, great levels always and inspiring man.
tej, very nice levels for my favourite kind of battle: normal.

Replay: http://recs.zamppe.com/replays/188/show ... uiz9534zer
Zero always suprise me with his amazing skills. Very nice route!
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Re: GAA suggestions thread 2018

Post by Grace » 28 Jul 2018, 15:44

Designer is in a really interesting place this year. I was thinking about this last night a bit. I think there's a definite difference between level making and level designing - hear me out on this - A level maker such as TL might create a lot of levels, many of them are really playable and deceptively well made, but there's no discernible vision to the level in terms of playability, theming or visuals. As an example of what defines a "Designer" to me, look at umiz -> Tons of effort and consideration put into how the level looks, and often more effort put into refining the levels playability beyond simple polygon placement (such as highly considered and specific shaping of polygons to achieve a design aim). I really don't think there are many true "Designer" people in this sense. Some people do that occasionally (see Blaztek for example with the well known Black030 level). Often you see a level designer make levels like this for cups/contests/packs, but abandon this style for making battle levels.

I feel that this is a level making style that danitah is starting to utilise very often now, and it's working wonders. As much as other level makers deserve credit, at this point in month 7 of 2018, I don't see any nomination for designer that's more suited than nominating danitah.

That said, I also feel that while he still has a ton of experience to gain and refining to do, tej actually fits a similar mold. His levels feel creative and refreshing, even when they aren't a level you enjoy to play, you can still understand what he was trying to achieve. The levels feel designed rather than just throwing triangles on a blank canvas and seeing what sticks.

I really feel like in the past, there hasn't been many level makers that are equivalent or comparable to what umiz does, so it's really nice to see this sort of consideration in level design.
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Re: GAA suggestions thread 2018

Post by Ruben » 28 Jul 2018, 16:13

Breakthrough: Tej (level design)

Dunno how his normal battle levels are, but his level pack and a few other random levels I've seen have been absolutely excellent. It's almost impossible to believe that this is a new player/designer.
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Re: GAA suggestions thread 2018

Post by Ramone » 28 Jul 2018, 16:45

Grace wrote:
28 Jul 2018, 15:44
Designer is in a really interesting place this year. I was thinking about this last night a bit. I think there's a definite difference between level making and level designing - hear me out on this - A level maker such as TL might create a lot of levels, many of them are really playable and deceptively well made, but there's no discernible vision to the level in terms of playability, theming or visuals. As an example of what defines a "Designer" to me, look at umiz -> Tons of effort and consideration put into how the level looks, and often more effort put into refining the levels playability beyond simple polygon placement (such as highly considered and specific shaping of polygons to achieve a design aim). I really don't think there are many true "Designer" people in this sense. Some people do that occasionally (see Blaztek for example with the well known Black030 level). Often you see a level designer make levels like this for cups/contests/packs, but abandon this style for making battle levels.

I feel that this is a level making style that danitah is starting to utilise very often now, and it's working wonders. As much as other level makers deserve credit, at this point in month 7 of 2018, I don't see any nomination for designer that's more suited than nominating danitah.

That said, I also feel that while he still has a ton of experience to gain and refining to do, tej actually fits a similar mold. His levels feel creative and refreshing, even when they aren't a level you enjoy to play, you can still understand what he was trying to achieve. The levels feel designed rather than just throwing triangles on a blank canvas and seeing what sticks.

I really feel like in the past, there hasn't been many level makers that are equivalent or comparable to what umiz does, so it's really nice to see this sort of consideration in level design.
You obv dont know anything about levelmaking.
Blaztek as an example of good levelmaker? He usually does everything wrong...
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Re: GAA suggestions thread 2018

Post by Hosp » 28 Jul 2018, 17:54

i personally enjoy Ramone kind of levs or even rawer, like Spef/Zweq/talli levels, but imo these very designed levs also good to hev osv, i just dont enjoy höyl them most of the time :P
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Re: GAA suggestions thread 2018

Post by zebra » 28 Jul 2018, 20:46

I agree with Ramone in the sense that I think that it's more important to have good playability than a good-looking level. But the best levels have them both. I think level designing means both of them: designing the styles and designing the outlook.
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Re: GAA suggestions thread 2018

Post by danitah » 28 Jul 2018, 21:04

Blaztek has some backwards ways of thinking when it comes to what makes a level a success or not. So while I understand what Ramone means, I still think Blaztek is a good designer overall, if you can look past this his levels most of the time has good playability and visuals.

The question about having a consistent style in your levels is an interesting one. My main goal when making levels is to try escaping my own habits and ways of thinking. But if I take it too far, levels will turn out quite shitty, so it's important to find a balance. I'm not claiming all of my levels has some totally new concept or anything, this is just my way of keeping levelmaking continually interesting, and I'm not saying this is the right way for other designers. Also I do quite often just fall back on some old level style. I think Ramone does this perfectly. You always feel like you are playing a Ramone level, so there is a certain style/trademark in all his levels, but his levels still feel very fresh.

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Re: GAA suggestions thread 2018

Post by kuchitsu » 29 Jul 2018, 00:16

danitah wrote:
28 Jul 2018, 21:04
Blaztek has some backwards ways of thinking when it comes to what makes a level a success or not.
What do you mean?

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Re: GAA suggestions thread 2018

Post by danitah » 29 Jul 2018, 00:39

Basically if there's anything unintentional in the level, like a different route than he planned, he will say the level is a failure, often blaming the players who found it.

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Re: GAA suggestions thread 2018

Post by Hosp » 29 Jul 2018, 04:27

rando mdrunk thought: i like utter chaos created randomly like, when a lev has been very planned, and the solutions for the best time is not at all what was expected, basically the greatest part of elma, dunno
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Re: GAA suggestions thread 2018

Post by Grace » 29 Jul 2018, 07:40

Ramone wrote:
28 Jul 2018, 16:45
You obv dont know anything about levelmaking.
Blaztek as an example of good levelmaker? He usually does everything wrong...
Not that there's any real need to prove you wrong, I'll just remind you that the level I referenced in that post was one of the 10 nominations in 2017 for GAA level, and was voted as top 5.
danitah wrote:Basically if there's anything unintentional in the level, like a different route than he planned, he will say the level is a failure, often blaming the players who found it.
I think this also just supports my point. That level has a very clear path that is "by design".
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Re: GAA suggestions thread 2018

Post by danitah » 29 Jul 2018, 09:11

Grace wrote:
29 Jul 2018, 07:40
danitah wrote:Basically if there's anything unintentional in the level, like a different route than he planned, he will say the level is a failure, often blaming the players who found it.
I think this also just supports my point. That level has a very clear path that is "by design".
There's nothing wrong with this, the point where it gets silly is when he makes a lev that looks open to many routes, but there's a very specific route that he wants you to take, and he blames you for ruining his lev if you find another route that is faster. He also recently made a lev with pipe shortcut and invisible poly in the end of pipe just to make this point.

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Re: GAA suggestions thread 2018

Post by Hosp » 29 Jul 2018, 23:39

I only get mad if I make cool levik imo, then is some fuked up 20s faster route because i forgot put an apple, but only mad at self for making lev 'bad'.
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Re: GAA suggestions thread 2018

Post by BlaZtek » 31 Jul 2018, 17:10

Nice to come across backshacking in a negative sense... :roll: In the battle package "Black" I have a clear vision of the unity of aesthetics and function. I always try to get the kuski to choose the route I've planned. In some levels, I plan more than one route, but my main goal is that they should be completed at about the same time. Then you might understand what I mean that the level is unsuccessful when someone finds a route that cuts five seconds from the others. I care very much about how the courses feel, they should be fun and challenging but at the same time beautiful. So, of course, I'm a bit upset when Ramone and Daniel say what they say. I do not think there's anything wrong with my way of making levels. Some actually say that they like what I do too, and I like my levels also.

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Re: GAA suggestions thread 2018

Post by Hosp » 31 Jul 2018, 21:54

I like many Blaztek levs i can enjoy levs from any style, nothing wrong with your style of make imo
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Re: GAA suggestions thread 2018

Post by Ruben » 31 Jul 2018, 23:15

I generally like the Black levs, and it feels very unfair for Ram to berate you for doing "everything wrong" when that's clearly not true. Nevermind the fact that what kind of levs you like is 100% subjective, so you have to go to great lenghts to make a lev that's objectively "wrong."

Then again, it's Ram talking so remember taking his words with a pinch of salt. I've found mean words from him to rarely have malicious intent, it's just his brutally honest way of communicating (though I guess he could chime in here if I'm mistaken). And he's definitely the most vocal kuski, but that doesn't mean everyone agrees with him. :wink:
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Re: GAA suggestions thread 2018

Post by danitah » 1 Aug 2018, 03:27

Let me rephrase, I don't think there's a big problem with this way of making levs, it's just not something I usually do. Maybe I should try it a bit since I want to be open to as many different ways of thinking as possible.

To explain briefly why I generally don't put an intended route in an open lev, I like to use two basic approaches: Either make an open lev that has a lot of opportunities and gives a sense of freedom, or make a straightforward lev that has good playability. Mixing these two is like giving a false sense of freedom since really the player is just looking for the intended route, instead of finding his own.

I can't say all blaz levs are bad because of this, actually I like black levs a lot, and as I mentioned in idol topic I also used them briefly for inspiration. It might also just be a small percentage of black levels where this could be an issue.

You have to remember that the more open lev you make, the bigger is the chance of something unexpected, and the harder it will be to predict how people will play.

The biggest problem I have is really how you are blaming the player. Anyway this is also not something that has happened all that often.

I remember Ramone also telling bludek that his way of making levels is wrong, when obviously the lev Ramone chose from bludek for wcup was made in the same way, and I think that lev was a big success.

I think telling designers how they should make levels is just counterproductive, and is more likely to deter them than making them change levelmaking style. Of course there is still room for constructive criticism. So keep making levels how you like blaztek, it's working very well for you!

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Re: GAA suggestions thread 2018

Post by umiz » 1 Aug 2018, 07:37

I love every level that is started as battle! Bad levels is a myth. I’ve never played a bad Blaztek.
The problem is that too few start levels!
Start em’ and win GAA!
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Re: GAA suggestions thread 2018

Post by pawq » 1 Aug 2018, 13:38

umiz wrote:
1 Aug 2018, 07:37
Bad levels is a myth.
:wink2:

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Re: GAA suggestions thread 2018

Post by danitah » 13 Aug 2018, 20:44

iCS for contribution for putting big effort in making a wide variety of videos. This helps a lot in keeping the community alive and will surely serve as very nostalgic memoribilia for looking back at events in the future.

zero for achievement for reaching 50% win rate in overall battles! very sik!

skint for achievement for finishing whole idol pack in less than 24 hours since release: There's 463 levels in pack, some of them are quite hard, and there's still only one other person who has finished pack when almost 2 months have passed, and players have played it quite actively also. So I think it's pretty nice achievement.

for externalist: FinMan and Hosp based on idol pack activity.

contest: FFCUP, best event of the year so far for me.

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Re: GAA suggestions thread 2018

Post by Zero » 2 Sep 2018, 12:18

iCS for Contribution!

Making amazing videos actively and being a very important part of the scene atm! 8)
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Re: GAA suggestions thread 2018

Post by Orcc » 5 Nov 2018, 14:50

Externalist: finman, adi and John for Idoling (finman was the first true queen, adi was then catching up quickly and now John is on his way to a revolution)
ReDesign Cup 2

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Re: GAA suggestions thread 2018

Post by tej » 13 Nov 2018, 17:52

http://elmaonline.net/battles/137003 ereol387 by error.

What a lev! Super cool giant feeling, cool freefall at 1:10 in rec, top right is a puzzle!

I am excited about error levels all the time, this is one of the best but not the only one.

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Re: GAA suggestions thread 2018

Post by John » 25 Nov 2018, 22:12

Best level pack: Idol
Best designer: danitah

Long time since I had this much fun with a level pack. Must've been hard to make 463 levels with such variation. Could've been without the pipes and idol180 but otherwise very enjoyable. Cool concept!
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