Mopolauta

Elasto Mania board
It is currently 18 Oct 2017, 17:28

All times are UTC [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 45 posts ] 
Author Message
PostPosted: 28 Jan 2013, 18:04 
Offline
Kuski

Joined: 15 Jun 2007, 13:17
Posts: 446
Location: Finland
What kind of additions should there be in Elma 2 level format (compared to original Elma)?

Some initial thoughts:

  • New polygon type: texture polygon. It would be possible to select texture for this polygon, and also whether it is solid (like ground polygons) or hollow (like normal pictures and textures). If it's hollow, clipping type could be chosen (ground/sky/both). This would remove the need for traditional, rectangular textures (and their masks too).
  • Choose initial direction and angle for kuski.
  • Increase/remove limits (maximum width/height, number of apples/killers/flowers, level title/filename length).
  • Choose amount of apples that need to be taken before flower.
  • The name of level designer stored in level file. Maybe the creation date of level too.
  • Allow levels without flowers (all apples collected = finish).

Opinions? More ideas?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 28 Jan 2013, 19:15 
Offline
Kuski
User avatar

Joined: 28 Jul 2010, 21:06
Posts: 338
Location: Szekszárd - Hungary
Choose amount of apples that need to be taken before flower -> that is what we are do in elma1 :lol:

Allow levels without flowers (all apples collected = finish) -> nah please 8)


idea: new battle type: you can add a time at the startballe and if one of the players make this time or better he win. (if noone can make the given time the winner who has the best time at the end of the battle ) 8O

* correct the bugs in flagtag battle 1/2 ( sometimes i lost/get flag without even touch any motobike -enough being close to the flag owner -
2/2 : after dead -> should be random start place - in case of nabbing in one place without brain :idea: :arrow: :wink: :beer: :roll:

_________________
Lousku: Snajdig, forgive all my subtle and not so subtle hostility towards you in the past. I can't go on harassing anyone who produces sach sweet wisdom.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 28 Jan 2013, 20:36 
Offline
Kuski
User avatar

Joined: 24 Aug 2008, 19:56
Posts: 5555
Location: Southampton, UK
snajdig wrote:
Choose amount of apples that need to be taken before flower -> that is what we are do in elma1 :lol:
can you set up a lev so that anyone who takes e.g. 10 apples out of 20 can already finish? :lol:?
snajdig wrote:
Allow levels without flowers (all apples collected = finish) -> nah please 8)
This in turn can be done in EOL, simply by placing a flower behind each apple. Though having simply such an option would be much more convenient.
snajdig wrote:
idea: new battle type: ...
This is topic for level format, not for battle types.

Now about the features:
- The ability to make polys textured is a must imo
- I'm not sure about chosing initial angle and direction of the kuski. The direction doesn't really affect anything but angle... Figuring out how to volt/gas/brake at start to get to the right position is one of the challenges of many levs, that would be ruined :/
- Increasing/removing limits - sure, why not?
- Choosing the number of appels that need to be collected to finish is quite a nice idea, it would encourage many new types of brainer levs!
- Name of maker stored - why not, I'm often curious whose lev I'm playing
- Levels without flowers - sure, as I said above, a more convenient way of putting a flower behind each apple.

+ my idea:
I think I've suggested it before, but what about giving particular edges parameters "horizontal", "vertical", "perpendicular to", "parallel to", "at an angle of ... to"? Would help making pies and geometrical levs!

_________________
Image
Team TR
Multi WR in Labyrinth with GRob
Best Internal Total Times, Pipe stats & Pipe archive
World kuski map, World Cup stats


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 28 Jan 2013, 20:42 
Offline
39mins club
User avatar

Joined: 7 Apr 2007, 12:15
Posts: 6291
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Pawq wrote:
snajdig wrote:
Choose amount of apples that need to be taken before flower -> that is what we are do in elma1 :lol:
can you set up a lev so that anyone who takes e.g. 10 apples out of 20 can already finish? :lol:?
You can. Just start with compressed wheels so that either both wheels or head and wheel touch the same apple(s) from the start. I think you can enable this in EOL by checking the box "Allow apple bugs" or sach, but I'm not 100% sure. Basically what you do is you force a certain number of hooked bugs.

_________________
John: lol hittade ett popcorn i naveln
(19:52:06) (@Madnezz) The Golden Apple Award goes to.....
(19:52:36) (@Madnezz) ib9814.lev by igge!!!
Zweq wrote:
99.9999% of nabs haven't even opened the book yet and most of those that have are still on the first pages


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 28 Jan 2013, 21:31 
Offline
Kuski
User avatar

Joined: 5 Feb 2010, 00:25
Posts: 2759
Location: expensive land of dads
Pawq wrote:
I'm not sure about chosing initial angle and direction of the kuski. The direction doesn't really affect anything but angle... Figuring out how to volt/gas/brake at start to get to the right position is one of the challenges of many levs, that would be ruined :/
How so? It would be up to the designer. This would add designing freedom while removing nothing from the game.
Pawq wrote:
I think I've suggested it before, but what about giving particular edges parameters "horizontal", "vertical", "perpendicular to", "parallel to", "at an angle of ... to"? Would help making pies and geometrical levs!
Hmm? What does this have to do with lev format?

In addition to designer name, how about a description field that could be made as long as needed (maybe with some 1000 char limit, dunno)? Bigger collaboration levs and such could surely use some text space.

Trigger apples, moving polygons, event scripting etc are abandoned ideas? Honestly those sound like tons of effort for something that wouldn't be used much. Then again, they could launch a subscene of elma rpg. :P Just throwing that out there.

_________________
then again i don't know anything
maybe easier not to think abouut alöl things thought than not things thought ... or something..=?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 28 Jan 2013, 22:05 
Offline
35mins club
User avatar

Joined: 28 Nov 2002, 15:54
Posts: 3706
Location: suo mesta
the power to change all the initial bike related variables, even velocity vector. or maybe it would be ghey ? then again there are those speedboost-start levs out there already

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 28 Jan 2013, 22:26 
Offline
Kuski
User avatar

Joined: 28 Jul 2010, 21:06
Posts: 338
Location: Szekszárd - Hungary
I love Pawq. He is always so cruel, quite funny :lol:

_________________
Lousku: Snajdig, forgive all my subtle and not so subtle hostility towards you in the past. I can't go on harassing anyone who produces sach sweet wisdom.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 28 Jan 2013, 22:28 
Offline
39mins club
User avatar

Joined: 9 May 2003, 13:30
Posts: 4441
Location: Valmiera, Latvia
Yeah start velocity would remove the need for me to make the speedboost polygons when I want that :)

_________________
39:37,91


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 29 Jan 2013, 00:10 
Offline
37mins club
User avatar

Joined: 22 Apr 2005, 05:12
Posts: 2196
Location: New Zealand
Currently the sky background scrolls left and right while playing. There should be an option to make the scrolling: Left/Right, Up/Down, or Fixed.
So if you would like to use a ground texture for a background to create a cave-like level, you can select Fixed BG so it doesn't move. This saves having to make a giant texture mask clipped to sky.
Vertically scrolling BG would be used in levels like Downhill. I don't know if it will look nice or not...

And I second the Description field idea. It could also be used for story telling.

_________________
Image Image


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 29 Jan 2013, 00:15 
Offline
38mins club
User avatar

Joined: 23 Sep 2009, 10:56
Posts: 1432
Location: Some pub in Prague
Actually all of the initial ideas are great. They might be THE reason to play elma 2 for me. If there is no such thing, there would be no need to leave EOL for me so far.

I am not sure how far can Elma 2 go, but it would be super awesome to have all the features from external editors in elma2. Especially: auto grass, text tool, tool for making polygons out of .jpg, pie tool and connect polygons.

last idea: It would be cool to have the option to put ANY picture into the level. Like anything dl-ed from the internet. But maybe it would increase the size of the levels too much, so I am not 100% sure about this idea.

_________________
http://elmaonline.net/players/Bludek
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 29 Jan 2013, 02:51 
Offline
Kuski
User avatar

Joined: 24 Aug 2008, 19:56
Posts: 5555
Location: Southampton, UK
Igge wrote:
You can. Just start with compressed wheels so that either both wheels or head and wheel touch the same apple(s) from the start.
Tru, my bad.
Lous - I think it is? Or is adding appropriate features to the editor enough?

_________________
Image
Team TR
Multi WR in Labyrinth with GRob
Best Internal Total Times, Pipe stats & Pipe archive
World kuski map, World Cup stats


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 29 Jan 2013, 03:45 
Offline
Kuski
User avatar

Joined: 5 Feb 2010, 00:25
Posts: 2759
Location: expensive land of dads
Pawq wrote:
Lous - I think it is? Or is adding appropriate features to the editor enough?
I'm not sure what you mean. If the result is the same type of vertices that can be made manually, it'd just be an editor feature. Wondering if I misunderstood something..?

_________________
then again i don't know anything
maybe easier not to think abouut alöl things thought than not things thought ... or something..=?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 29 Jan 2013, 04:37 
Offline
39mins club
User avatar

Joined: 19 Nov 2005, 10:45
Posts: 4527
Location: Deep in your Imagination, Twirling your Dreams and Weaving your thoughts.
I make comment on as many of these as i can.

1. Textured Polygons/Separate Polygons FOR texture.
- This is probably a pretty easy feature to code and it's remarkably useful to designers. I think it would best work by altering the polygon in the same way we currently make grass. -> right click, set polygon mode from normal to texture and that opens up the texture selector/whether or not it's a hollow polygon or whatever. I 100% agree that this should be an addition.

2. Initial direction and angle for Kuski.
- This is actually half a gameplay change and it may limit creativity in styles to some degree - but i feel the freedom it brings the designer far outweighs that. Initial direction is something that should have been in the game since the start and initial angle is just a matter of implementing the ability to fiddle with the rotatory axis in the designer - surely it's possible. I think this would be a decent feature but i won't be crying if it isn't implemented. However choosing initial direction is a must.

3. Increasing/removing limits
- I'm apprehensive. Increasing limits is certainly fine, however i think removing them completely would encourage some really terrible 10 minute falling levels and levels with 999999 apples or killers. Realistically the only levels that would seriously benefit from increasing apple and killer count are your typical apple battle types, long ff's (80 levs) and long pipes. Maybe increase limit to 1000 with the option to patch it later to higher limits. I think increasing maximum width and height much the same situation. Increase it but don't remove it, but leave the option to remove if we so desire long in the future. Level title/filename length should definitely be increased but not removed either. Filename length at 8 characters is far too short, but i don't foresee anyone needing more than like 25 characters. Master_Cup_3_Event_1.lev kinda things. Ingame level names maybe have a maximum of 100 characters? Should also have the ability to select and type midway through the levelnames rather than having to delete the whole name when you typo the first word.



4. Choose amount of apples for finish.
- It's a good idea of course but the problem lies in the implementation. You can't have these levels without letting the player know they don't have to collect every apple - perhaps a custom graphic for these kind of levels where the apple displays how many apples are remaining before you can collect the flower? (if you need 5 more apples, there could be a big 5 inside the apples and flower.) You'd also need to keep in mind that it will have to be selectable within the editor how many apples are required for the level to be finished (Default would be to have this setting turned off.) but it must be limited so that you can't put the required number of apples higher than the total number of apples within the level.

5. Name of designer stored/date.
- This should be a given. Name of designer should always be stored in it's own field - would also be good for synchronisation with EOL sites. Perhaps you could link them so that if the level was created while you are online, it autofills with your EOL name? Date would be cool as an autofilling field but nowhere near as important.

6. Levels without flowers.
- Also a good idea, easy to implement. Care would need to be taken however that there is an option to make the level unfinishable for levels such as slowness levels. We don't want it so if there is no flower and no apples, you automatically finish.

7. Pawqs idea of giving edges parameters. (Level Editor idea)
- It's actually a remarkably good idea and would be very useful for level designing. However if it is enabled by default, it would cause all sorts of havoc when you try to design. Perhaps have a selectable option in which if it selected, you can select an edge as you would a vertex and define it's position in space in the same manner as the current editor works, and with rightclicking the edge be able to choose it's angle and it's length. Angle is the most important part here.

8. Lousku's suggestion of level description.
- Super cool. Do it, would be useful for collab levels etc. Surely not that hard? I imagine sheer text would barely increase the filesize too.

9. Zweq's initial bike variables.
- Could increase designer freedom but would be terrible for levels with a triggered start such as first finish, onelife and so on unless giant steps were taken to display the initial variables - which i imagine most people wouldn't understand. I actually would love this feature for normal levels, but i can't help but see rage in Onelife battles where people hadn't realised they were moving on the bike start and lost because of it.

10. Lee's scrolling backgrounds.
- This feature would actually screw with us all for some time because we wouldn't be used to how the backgrounds move for a while. That being said - it is probably something that should have been in the game all along. Definitely worth implementation because it could help maximise the experience.

11. Bludek's external editor feature's.
- This becomes a matter of what do we feel is necessary? Pie tool would be helpful but not required. Auto grass would only be good if it's optimised so that you don't get grassed walls like the current autograss programs, text tool would be good, etc.

12. Bludek's picture's in levels.
- Filesize would likely be an issue unless you found some way to compress the image within the file. The problem is that currently picture's are not rendered from within the file but from within the lgr. The client recognises the level has a "picture" object and then renders the image there (Centered on that hollow object.) - this means that if this feature were to be implemented you'd have to revolutionise how the graphics work within the game. One possible option (but extremely hard to implement, i imagine) would be:

1. Have LGR's kept in individual folders with individual picture folders within those for the current pictures - rather than have the picture's compressed within the lgr.
2. When you import the picture into the level, the picture alters the picture's filetype into it's own compressed one and pastes there automatically. Essentially it's like importing resources
3. When you upload the level, the server checks all the "picture" objects within the level and identifies one's it doesn't recognise (essentially any that aren't the basic, provided pictures) - it then uploads these to a database on the server.
4. When you download the level, the server checks all the "picture" objects within the level and identifies those it doesn't have in your "pictures" folder and downloads them from the server's database.

The problem with this is it greatly slows down level uploading and downloading, is a lot of code and is kind of unrealistic with larger filesize pictures.

_________________
TT: 39:56:83 | AvgTT: 42:00:07 | Targets: 6 WC, 33 Pro, 15 Good | 20 Australian Records | Cyberscore! |
"Feelings of love are just a temporary lapse in judgement. Like a kind of mental illness." -- Suzumiya Haruhi


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 29 Jan 2013, 07:22 
Offline
Kuski
User avatar

Joined: 15 Dec 2011, 01:07
Posts: 299
Location: Norway
Just please do improve the ingame editor...

*Like u can use the vertex tool to draw a area, and then can choose it to be "mask" ! Then I dont need 1000 of those small maskits :)
*And If autograss possible, can it be improved please? Its so ugly :/
*And also please fix for flagtags, that lag problem, cause kuskie can steal my flag even hes not toutching me... And want to se flag in "F1 enter" mode.

Thats all I have for now, maybe update later.

Edit:
Two other important things...
* Be able to melt together two polygons
*And to copy a polygon, maybe even mirror it ?`

I know we hava many of this cool things in external editors, but ingame one is the real! And the one I prefere :)

_________________
Image
[13:22:24] (ImagebEAT) blaz super pro
[17:06:15] (ImageRamone) ok I suckj. blaz rules


Last edited by BlaZtek on 29 Jan 2013, 11:00, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 29 Jan 2013, 08:50 
Offline
37mins club
User avatar

Joined: 22 Apr 2005, 05:12
Posts: 2196
Location: New Zealand
The ability to rotate and (maybe) resize pictures, and the ability to crop pictures (in case, for example, you want to use one branch of a tree and not the whole thing).

_________________
Image Image


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 29 Jan 2013, 14:22 
Offline
Kuski
User avatar

Joined: 29 Jan 2012, 16:10
Posts: 277
Location: UK
textured polygongs = must

increased poly verticy size blablabla i see no reason not to put them in really. long fally levs may be interesting tbh :p i run out of verticies a lot when I make quiz level too, so yeah implement dat shit :D

also, make it possible for an lgr to be attatched to a balle. some lol moments and cool art could occur, force default option to be added ofc. it can't be that difficult to attatch lgr ^^

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 29 Jan 2013, 14:51 
Offline
Kuski
User avatar

Joined: 7 Dec 2010, 12:54
Posts: 393
Location: anal
more top scores hh.mm:ss.xxx maybe with date of the record

_________________
Image Image
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 29 Jan 2013, 20:51 
Offline
Kuski

Joined: 15 Jun 2007, 13:17
Posts: 446
Location: Finland
Pawq wrote:
I'm not sure about chosing initial angle and direction of the kuski. The direction doesn't really affect anything but angle... Figuring out how to volt/gas/brake at start to get to the right position is one of the challenges of many levs, that would be ruined :/
As Lousku said, nothing would get ruined. Old levels are not affected. You can still make levs where the initial position is classic (facing left).

Lousku wrote:
Trigger apples, moving polygons, event scripting etc are abandoned ideas?
Pretty much yea. Hard to implement.

Zweq wrote:
the power to change all the initial bike related variables, even velocity vector.
Besides initial direction, angle and velocity, I can't think of any other variables that would be useful to modify. Maybe angular velocity (rotation speed)? Would that be too much?

One-life battles wouldn't be a problem because there could be an arrow indicating the initial velocity.

Pawq wrote:
how about a description field that could be made as long as needed?
Yea, it's a good idea.

Lee wrote:
Currently the sky background scrolls left and right while playing. There should be an option to make the scrolling: Left/Right, Up/Down, or Fixed.
I think it would be enough to have two options: moving or fixed. I think vertical-only or horizontal-only scrolling is not necessary. Original Elma doesn't have vertical scrolling, which is why you can't notice if you're falling down (for example). Everyone's used to it, but it doesn't really make sense.

Bludek wrote:
It would be cool to have the option to put ANY picture into the level. Like anything dl-ed from the internet. But maybe it would increase the size of the levels too much, so I am not 100% sure about this idea.
Yeah I'm not sure about that idea either. I think it's better to have the graphics stored in one place (LGR).

Lee wrote:
The ability to rotate and (maybe) resize pictures, and the ability to crop pictures (in case, for example, you want to use one branch of a tree and not the whole thing).
Rotating and resizing pictures is definitely a good idea. Cropping - why not, although I can't think of any other use cases...

analcactus wrote:
more top scores hh.mm:ss.xxx maybe with date of the record
Scores won't be saved in level file anymore, but in separate files.

All the other suggestions were related to level editor (or battles/bugs), not the level format itself :) but of course the level editor will be as good as possible.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 30 Jan 2013, 01:26 
Offline
37mins club
User avatar

Joined: 22 Apr 2005, 05:12
Posts: 2196
Location: New Zealand
Smibu wrote:
I think it would be enough to have two options: moving or fixed. I think vertical-only or horizontal-only scrolling is not necessary. Original Elma doesn't have vertical scrolling, which is why you can't notice if you're falling down (for example). Everyone's used to it, but it doesn't really make sense.

I thought about this some more while I was trying to get to sleep last night. And I came to the conclusion that vertically scrolling is a bad idea because it would ruin some peoples LGRs. Like if someone wants to make an LGR with islands in the background (sky above and water below them), you know what I mean.
So I agree with your decision.

Smibu wrote:
Rotating and resizing pictures is definitely a good idea. Cropping - why not, although I can't think of any other use cases...

I also thought about this and decided that resizing is a bad idea if we stick with PNG image format. Rotate is still much needed though, and cropping too.

_________________
Image Image


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 30 Jan 2013, 07:20 
Offline
Kuski
User avatar

Joined: 15 Dec 2011, 01:07
Posts: 299
Location: Norway
Smibu said: "of course the level editor will be as good as possible."

BlaZtek says: Thank You :)
On a side note: Maybe get a few new texture types? In the spirit of Brick ground and the desert stone thingy :)
But please not make it look more smooth looking (many pixels) Want it raw like the originals, Maybe a job for LeeLand ?

_________________
Image
[13:22:24] (ImagebEAT) blaz super pro
[17:06:15] (ImageRamone) ok I suckj. blaz rules


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 30 Jan 2013, 11:45 
Offline
35mins club
User avatar

Joined: 28 Nov 2002, 15:54
Posts: 3706
Location: suo mesta
why not wheel positions too smibu and possibly head position also? start in 'stretch-hang', tight pipe, etc

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 30 Jan 2013, 14:50 
Offline
Kuski
User avatar

Joined: 24 Aug 2008, 19:56
Posts: 5555
Location: Southampton, UK
I agree, but this was my first thought:
It's still actually a challenge for the designer to make an (enjoyable) entrance to a pie or a stretched hang...

_________________
Image
Team TR
Multi WR in Labyrinth with GRob
Best Internal Total Times, Pipe stats & Pipe archive
World kuski map, World Cup stats


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 30 Jan 2013, 15:54 
Offline
39mins club
User avatar

Joined: 7 Apr 2007, 12:15
Posts: 6291
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
just include automatic levmaker and we wonät have to do anything) GAA rng

_________________
John: lol hittade ett popcorn i naveln
(19:52:06) (@Madnezz) The Golden Apple Award goes to.....
(19:52:36) (@Madnezz) ib9814.lev by igge!!!
Zweq wrote:
99.9999% of nabs haven't even opened the book yet and most of those that have are still on the first pages


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 30 Jan 2013, 23:21 
Offline
35mins club
User avatar

Joined: 28 Nov 2002, 15:54
Posts: 3706
Location: suo mesta
you wouldnt want to try start like this ?

Image

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 31 Jan 2013, 07:28 
Offline
Kuski
User avatar

Joined: 29 Jan 2012, 16:10
Posts: 277
Location: UK
gaa art

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 31 Jan 2013, 20:30 
Offline
Kuski
User avatar

Joined: 6 Jan 2009, 13:08
Posts: 1987
Location: Srdcom vychodniar
i think starting volting velocity, speed and stuff shouldn´t be implemented. However, initial gravity and rotation of kuski would be good. (head turning is redundant imo)

_________________
ImageImage


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 31 Jan 2013, 23:42 
Offline
39mins club
User avatar

Joined: 9 May 2003, 13:30
Posts: 4441
Location: Valmiera, Latvia
Brilliant Zweq, possibilities are endless!

_________________
39:37,91


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 1 Feb 2013, 02:38 
Offline
Kuski
User avatar

Joined: 5 Feb 2010, 00:25
Posts: 2759
Location: expensive land of dads
Tigro wrote:
i think starting volting velocity, speed and stuff shouldn´t be implemented.
Why would you make a post like this? Assuming you're trying to make an impact on development, have some self-respect and explain yourself. "Removes nothing, only adds freedom" was already mentioned in this topic, can you give any response at all?

/unreasonably angry post sry

_________________
then again i don't know anything
maybe easier not to think abouut alöl things thought than not things thought ... or something..=?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 1 Feb 2013, 12:39 
Offline
Kuski
User avatar

Joined: 5 Dec 2008, 16:19
Posts: 1013
Location: a position or point in physical space
Haruhi wrote:
3. Increasing/removing limits
- I'm apprehensive. Increasing limits is certainly fine, however i think removing them completely would encourage some really terrible 10 minute falling levels and levels with 999999 apples or killers. Realistically the only levels that would seriously benefit from increasing apple and killer count are your typical apple battle types, long ff's (80 levs) and long pipes. Maybe increase limit to 1000 with the option to patch it later to higher limits. I think increasing maximum width and height much the same situation. Increase it but don't remove it, but leave the option to remove if we so desire long in the future. Level title/filename length should definitely be increased but not removed either. Filename length at 8 characters is far too short, but i don't foresee anyone needing more than like 25 characters. Master_Cup_3_Event_1.lev kinda things. Ingame level names maybe have a maximum of 100 characters? Should also have the ability to select and type midway through the levelnames rather than having to delete the whole name when you typo the first word.




Well 1000 and 999999 apples/killers are both ridiculous amount. 30 seconds or 10 minutes falls are ridiculous too. You assume that people will abuse all limits, while in reality we rarely see battles that even abuse current limits. It's not that you can't troll in EOL. You can do it, but people quickly got over it. You can hide polygons behind apples, put way too much flowers, apples (20 apples can be too much in wrong level), killers, but it rarely happen We had period with "all" levels being pipes, uphills, but they all are pretty much over. Even I stopped making huge circle levels with lots of apples inside. Most of designers design reasonable levels that can be played finished during battle time (when 60 minutes FF, the levels should be finishable in about 30 minutes). I mean why FF shouldn't be just a straight, long level as opposed to current levels that must fit within some square? As long as battle is finishable within some reasonable time and apples/killers don't make it annoying I see no reason to put any arbitrary limits.

I guess the game may also be designed to allow mods to limit online battle levels parameters (like currently with special battles rights), but game as such for "offline" purposes should accept any size of levels (probably limited by game engine, far beyond anyones needs and you don't rewrite the code only to impose old limits). Mods already have ability to revoke rights and Elma 2 will certainly retain that ability.

The level name must fit into game menu etc, so 25 characters limit sounds very reasonable. I'm not arguing that.

_________________
Lousku wrote:
could you mayke shorter sig please :( mega annoying and also against rules :()


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 1 Feb 2013, 14:08 
Offline
Kuski
User avatar

Joined: 30 Aug 2009, 20:55
Posts: 1626
Location: Uppsala, Sweden.
Make it possible to start battles that are like 3h so we can start FFs like CP3 with the possibility of finishing lol. Wrong thread I realized now. Using phone orka copy paste elsewhere sorry.

_________________
Image
kartoffel


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 1 Feb 2013, 14:23 
Offline
39mins club
User avatar

Joined: 7 Apr 2007, 12:15
Posts: 6291
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Yeah. But only people who have the rights to start special balles should be able to start balles >1h. that way we won't have retard AKBs who start some 1min lev for 3h.

_________________
John: lol hittade ett popcorn i naveln
(19:52:06) (@Madnezz) The Golden Apple Award goes to.....
(19:52:36) (@Madnezz) ib9814.lev by igge!!!
Zweq wrote:
99.9999% of nabs haven't even opened the book yet and most of those that have are still on the first pages


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 1 Feb 2013, 16:20 
Offline
Kuski

Joined: 15 Jun 2007, 13:17
Posts: 446
Location: Finland
Updated wiki, added Level format section: http://wiki.elmaonline.net/Elma_2

Added also two Jappe's suggestions:
  • Option to force apples to be taken in a specific order.
  • Set weights for apples (and allow finishing when the total weight of collected apples is at least equal to a specified limit). This is a generalization of "Choose amount of apples that need to be taken before flower".

@Lee: I guess resizing can be implemented anyway because it's useful to be able to shrink pictures, and it's not hard to implement.
@Zweq: I agree, except being able to adjust head position sounds weird. I mean, the head would immediately return to its "normal" position anyway when starting lev, so it wouldn't add much value.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 3 Feb 2013, 05:35 
Offline
37mins club
User avatar

Joined: 22 Apr 2005, 05:12
Posts: 2196
Location: New Zealand
Meh.

_________________
Image Image


Last edited by Lee on 3 Feb 2013, 13:51, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 3 Feb 2013, 09:39 
Offline
Kuski
User avatar

Joined: 13 Feb 2007, 11:14
Posts: 1857
Location: Jyväskylä, Finland
The first image is why there is a thing called zoom textures in eolconf already? :f

But yes, nice idea otherwise.

_________________
... Pipe levels ... Höylä levels ...
Image
Image
Signatür ruined by SveinR - smaller plz :*
"I knew it!" - Doomsayer


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 3 Feb 2013, 10:08 
Offline
37mins club
User avatar

Joined: 22 Apr 2005, 05:12
Posts: 2196
Location: New Zealand
When I check zoom textures it doesn't zoom the sky to the full height of the monitor, but about 90%.

_________________
Image Image


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 3 Feb 2013, 13:31 
Offline
Kuski

Joined: 15 Jun 2007, 13:17
Posts: 446
Location: Finland
I don't know about this. Implementing something like "central image" just because we want some sun in the background sounds questionable. Would there be any other use cases? Can we not just leave the sun out from LGRs? :)

And how far should we go trying to imitate real life environment?

Your example pictures suggest that the background would not move vertically at all. So that implies horizontal-only scrolling should be possible, or else those types of sky pictures would be awful. But what if the user zooms out? Should there be some "Disallow sky zooming for this level" -thing? Also, there should be some hint telling the hills should be at the bottom of the screen; otherwise it would look stupid.

Now that I think about it, even the fixed background has some problems. What if the sky picture doesn't cover the whole screen? Should the sky be repeated, or fill the rest with something?

My opinion is that sky should be just... sky. It should look fine when it is repeated in any direction (= no suns/mountains/hills).

Lee wrote:
When I check zoom textures it doesn't zoom the sky to the full height of the monitor, but about 90%.
When that checkbox is checked, the zoom level depends on the value in eolconf.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 3 Feb 2013, 13:48 
Offline
37mins club
User avatar

Joined: 22 Apr 2005, 05:12
Posts: 2196
Location: New Zealand
I'm thinking about the possibilities of graphical customisation, but I guess I should just forget about it.

_________________
Image Image


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 3 Feb 2013, 22:52 
Offline
39mins club
User avatar

Joined: 19 Nov 2005, 10:45
Posts: 4527
Location: Deep in your Imagination, Twirling your Dreams and Weaving your thoughts.
Lee wrote:
I'm thinking about the possibilities of graphical customisation, but I guess I should just forget about it.


Nonetheless, this isn't relevant to level format so it should be discussed later.

_________________
TT: 39:56:83 | AvgTT: 42:00:07 | Targets: 6 WC, 33 Pro, 15 Good | 20 Australian Records | Cyberscore! |
"Feelings of love are just a temporary lapse in judgement. Like a kind of mental illness." -- Suzumiya Haruhi


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 11 Feb 2013, 02:45 
Offline
38mins club
User avatar

Joined: 4 Apr 2008, 23:46
Posts: 885
Don't forget windows 8 :( play play play

_________________
My Youtube Channel Level Stats Maker Battle Notifier!

Image
Image
Signatür ruined by SveinR - smaller plz :*


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 27 Feb 2013, 11:39 
Offline
Kuski
User avatar

Joined: 15 Dec 2011, 01:07
Posts: 299
Location: Norway
Miss u too Pab.

_________________
Image
[13:22:24] (ImagebEAT) blaz super pro
[17:06:15] (ImageRamone) ok I suckj. blaz rules


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 27 Feb 2013, 14:31 
Offline
Kuski
User avatar

Joined: 6 Jan 2009, 13:08
Posts: 1987
Location: Srdcom vychodniar
how is it about making level when you start "outside" of the polygons, so you can "jump away" from the level (and get interracial error)?
Will this be somehow fixed/nerfed or something? Maybe creating invisible borders far behind the last vertex?

_________________
ImageImage


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 27 Feb 2013, 14:42 
Offline
39mins club
User avatar

Joined: 7 Apr 2007, 12:15
Posts: 6291
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
And how often does that happen? Like once every 10 years or so?

_________________
John: lol hittade ett popcorn i naveln
(19:52:06) (@Madnezz) The Golden Apple Award goes to.....
(19:52:36) (@Madnezz) ib9814.lev by igge!!!
Zweq wrote:
99.9999% of nabs haven't even opened the book yet and most of those that have are still on the first pages


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 27 Feb 2013, 15:58 
Offline
Kuski

Joined: 15 Jun 2007, 13:17
Posts: 446
Location: Finland
@Tigro: I tested that just now, the ride just ends as if the player died. Maybe there could be some message telling what happened (but this is not related to lev format anyway).


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 27 Feb 2013, 17:51 
Offline
Kuski
User avatar

Joined: 6 Jan 2009, 13:08
Posts: 1987
Location: Srdcom vychodniar
Igge wrote:
And how often does that happen? Like once every 10 years or so?

actually, I was experiencing this quite often. And I think we want to have lameproof game.

_________________
ImageImage


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: 27 Feb 2013, 18:23 
Offline
39mins club
User avatar

Joined: 23 Nov 2004, 23:05
Posts: 4024
Location: Tórshavn, Faroe Islands
Please make it possible to create levels using keyboard only. Like in Movies/Series when they want to edit/zoom pictures/videos they only navigate using the keyboard. (example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IRBo5ZGcyVA). Notice the music of the keyboard in the background.
This could result in ubermicro level making!

_________________
Thorze wrote:
I just wanted to make a cool topic like Juish have cool topics..


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 45 posts ] 

All times are UTC [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group