Target List Personal Stats

Look for replays and levels and ask people's times.

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John
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by John »

nick-o-matic wrote:Maybe milagros meant that we should take the limit times approximately from current top-100 lists and then keep them same. I think that would be the best way.

Also I think that milagros's targets are too easy. At least WC and pro are actually in many cases what they are nowdays! But that would change if we added there completely new target. Would

top5 - 1337
top20 - world class
top50 - pro
top100 - good
top300 - ok
top500 - beginner

be good?

Adding the new target - "1337" or whatever - would make the system a bit more complicated. But now the revolution due to the new system would be smaller because WC and pro times would remain approximately the same.
53.xx Ramp is not WC and hardly has been for several years (to take an example), 1.33 AH to take another. No, that way of putting targets just doesn't work. We need to discuss new targets and not base them record-lists.
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Raven »

im in if we discuss about new targets.
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Jarkko »

I have too some target times in my mind in levels where I've had enough experience.
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Xiphias
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Xiphias »

Last update was back in last quarter of 2005 I think.
Just check the difference from
TargetList1.2
to
TargetList 1.3

WC and Pro TT's were 38;28,16 and 40:09,67 in 1.2 and got lowered to 38:09,32 and 39:48,08 in v1.3.

Well my point is that Wr total time at this point was around 36.4x.xx now it is a minute lower 35.4x.xx.
So easily cut 20 seconds of WC times :D
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by nick-o-matic »

John wrote:53.xx Ramp is not WC and hardly has been for several years (to take an example), 1.33 AH to take another. No, that way of putting targets just doesn't work. We need to discuss new targets and not base them record-lists.
I meant that you should take those targets from top-100 -lists only approximately. But you should start working from those toplists because they simply are pretty good meter of quality of your time and also by using them the same targents become more easily equally hard in different levels.

But of course those new styles mess things up there. Also some levels have been more popular than others etc so you can change times even rougly from the toplist-based-ones. So there should be some kind of major target time discussion for sure.

Anyway maybe the main point of my post was that we propably need bigger amount of different targets. At least if getting the highest target should be so hard that it's serious concern for the WR-holder (like you planned and I agree) there will develop way too big differences between different targets if we've got only 5 of them.
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Lukazz »

but I really think it's important to ask not so good players too, with some 50 TT. cause i just can't say what ... for example OK target for sink should be.
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Lukazz »

I think WC targets should be like this:

warm up: 14.09
flat track: 15.21
twin peaks: 17.95
o&a: 30.10
uphill: 20.15
long haul: 31.00
hi flyer: 31.50
tag: 20.95
tunnel terror: 56.50
the steppes: 11.00
...
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Raven »

01. 14.09 would be good
02. Dunno really about this, should it be changed. 15.30 is quite hard and needs lot of work.
03. At least 18.00
04. Dont know, haven't hoyled that much.
05. Dont know, haven't hoyled that much.
06. 32.00
07. 32.50 (needs brutal. wc)
08. 21.10
09. 58.50
10. 11.05
11. 24.50
12. 21.40
13. 15.00
14. Dont know, haven't hoyled that much.
15. 45.00 at least.
16. Dont know, haven't hoyled that much.
17. 55.30
18. Dont know, haven't hoyled that much.
19. Dont know, haven't hoyled that much.
20. 1.01.00
21. Dont know, haven't hoyled that much.
22. 39.50 kinda easy. But no way 40,30, that is some sucky time for WC time.
23. Dont know, haven't hoyled that much.
24. 49.00 (needs WC brutal)
25. Dont know.
26. 23.50
27. Dont know, haven't hoyled that much.
28. Dont know, haven't hoyled that much.
29. Dont know.
30. Dont know.
31. 1.16.00 - 1.18.00
32. Dont know
33. 1.00.00 or maybe even 58.00
34. Dont know, haven't hoyled that much.
35. 2.20.00
36. Dont know, haven't hoyled that much.
37. Dont know, haven't hoyled that much.
38. 30.00
39. 40.50
40. 1.25.00
41. Dont know, haven't hoyled that much.
42. Dont know, haven't hoyled that much.
43. 57.00
44. Dont know, haven't hoyled that much.
45. Dont know, haven't hoyled that much.
46. 55.00
47. Dont know, haven't hoyled that much.
48. Dont know, haven't hoyled that much.
49. 39.00
50. Dont know, haven't hoyled that much.
51. Dont know, haven't hoyled that much.
52. 25.05
53. Dont know, haven't hoyled that much.
54. 1.19.00

Just made quick list for giving some way.
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Lukazz
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Lukazz »

Raven wrote: 06. 32.00
Too easy in my opinion, you could get 31.xx with some hoyling with old style too.
08. 21.10
way too easy.
15. 45.00 at least.
eh, what?
17. 55.30
20. 1.01.00
22. 39.50 kinda easy. But no way 40,30, that is some sucky time for WC time.
23. Dont know, haven't hoyled that much.
24. 49.00 (needs WC brutal)
26. 23.50
31. 1.16.00 - 1.18.00
agree, animal farm should be 1.16.50 i think. maybe upside down a bit better too.
33. 1.00.00 or maybe even 58.00
hm, 58 too hard, 1.00.00 bit too easy. maybe 59.50 or 59.00
35. 2.20.00
38. 30.00
39. 40.50
40. 1.25.00
43. 57.00
hm, hehe seems a bit hard, i'd say 57.50, rest agreed
46. 55.00
49. 39.00
52. 25.05
54. 1.19.00
agree

to continue my list.
warm up: 14.09
flat track: 15.21...
twin peaks: 17.95
o&a: 30.10
uphill: 20.15
long haul: 31.00
hi flyer: 31.50
tag: 20.95
tunnel terror: 56.50
the steppes: 11.00
okay, maybe flat track is really too hard...

gravity ride: 24.00
islands: 21.20
hill: 14.95
loop: 18.00, no clue actually
serpents: 53.00, no clue actually
new wave: 1.27.50
labyrinth: 55.30 sounds good
spiral: no clue
turnaround: 38.00?
upside down: 1.00.50
hangman: dunno
slalom: 39.50 seems ok
quick round: 37,50?
ramp frenzy: 49.00 seems ok
precarious: no clue
circa: 23.00
shelf life: 35.90?
bounce back: 51.50?
headbanger: 44,95
pipe: no clue
animal farm: 1.16.50
steep corner: no clue
ziggy: 59.20 or something
bumpy journey: 37.10?
labby pro: 2.20.00 looks good
fruit in the den: no clue, some 58
jaws: 55.50
curva: 30.00 seems good
haircut: 40.50 seems good
double trouble 1.25.00 seems good too :P
framework: 39,50
enduro: 49,30 is hard enough already imo
he he: 57.50
freefall: 11.67 or something
sink: no clue
bowling. 55.00 or 55.50
engima: 19.70?
downhill 48,50
what the heck. 39.00 is good
expert sys: 55.00
trix: something like 44.00
hang tight: i guess 25.00 or 25.05
apple harvest: ye something between 1.18.50 and 1.19.50
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Zweq »

14.07
15.20
17.90
30.10
20.00

31.00
31.00
21.00
56.00
11.00

23.50
21.20
14.50
17.80
53.00

1.26.00
54.30
44.80
37.00
59.50

14.60
39.10
36.50
44.00
24.70

22.30
34.90
51.00
44.00
33.10

1.15.00
43.00
57.00
36.60
2.18.00

58.00
54.00
29.60
39.60
1.23.00

39.30
48.00
57.00
11.60
32.70

55.00
19.60
47.00
38.50
54.00

43.00
24.90
17.30
1.18.00
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Lukazz »

well most of them are a bit too hard. uphill 20.00 wtf
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Zweq »

it's up to you if you wish to be world class !
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Lukazz »

hm, I just think that for example Tag 21.00 is quite easy with some hoyling and so is 11.00 on steppes but some others are way too hard like labby pro 2.18 wtf, uphill 20.00, double trouble 1.23.00 that's more the already suggested 1337-target.
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by teajay »

top10 - world class
top50 - pro
top100 - good
top200 - ok
top500 - beginner

I think this would be adequate.
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Jarkko »

WC times

01. warm up: 14.09. Just so that you need 14.0x to wc.
03. twin peaks: 17.89 sound about right. Don't know if the "new style" will effect this in the future.
05. uphill battle: 20.09
08. tag: 20.99. Needs under 21 to wc
10. steppes: 10.99. Under 11 to wc
14. loop-de-loop: 17.89
21. hangman: 14.59
25. precarious: 24.69
30. pipe: 33.29
32. steep corner: 42.99. Either you need very good old style or the zweq style.
38. curvaceous: 29.99. this is obvious, you need under 30 sec to wc.
44. freefall: 11.69 at least.
45. sink: 32.79
52. hang tight: 24.99, or could be even .89
53. hooked: 17.29

Note that all times ends with 9, because you need to be under something to get wc and thats how I would like to see it.
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Madness »

Waste of time. You can make new targets, but it will be soon out of date again.
I'd suggest delete any targets...
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by John »

WC should in my opinion be times so close to the WR that a little extra hoyling could get you the actual WR. You don't achieve WC by making semigood runs with best styles, you have to hoyl those styles or be lucky and finish with good time early ;o
Some suggestions for WC:

01. 14.07
02. 15.20
03. 17.85
04. 30.00
05. 20.00
06. 31.00
07. 31.00
08. 20.90
09. 55.50
10. 10.90
11. 23.30
12. 20.90
13. 14.20
14. 17.70
15. 53.00
16. 1.24.50
17. 54.30
18. 44.65
19. 36.60
20. 59.00
21. 14.50
22. 39.00
23. 37.00
24. 43.00
25. 24.50
26. 22.20
27. 34.60
28. 50.20
29. 43.70
30. 33.00
31. 1.13.50
32. 42.90
33. 56.50
34. 36.90
35. 2.16.50
36. 58.00
37. 54.50
38. 29.50
39. 39.50
40. 1.23.00
41. 39.00
42. 48.30
43. 56.80
44. 11.60
45. 32.70
46. 53.00
47. 19.50
48. 46.50
49. 38.30
50. 54.00
51. 43.00
52. 24.80
53. 17.25
54. 1.19.00

Some are probably too hard and some are probably too easy according to my definition at top.
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Lukazz »

omfg wtf, I really think there should be some 1337-target like nom suggested.
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by John »

Hehe, I just think World Class should be just that... World Class... :)
Some of my suggestions would leave only one guy in WC-range, but I think that's ok since the gap to the 2nd guy is so big in those cases. (Like Tunnel, New Wave, BB, Animal etc)
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by _FreaK_ »

with such targets wr replays should be shared imo, other way they are impsy
and with such logics shouldn't the target be changed after every new big improvement on the wr time?
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by John »

_FreaK_ wrote:with such targets wr replays should be shared imo, other way they are impsy
Who said everyone interested should be able to drive 54 WC?
_FreaK_ wrote:and with such logics shouldn't the target be changed after every new big improvement on the wr time?
Ye maybe they should
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by teajay »

but yes, nice reasoning there. So we better make pro even harder and good too. Since we are making the system interesting for the better half of elma playing people anyway. Seriously, a 49th time on what the heck, would you consider that professional? It's more like "pretty good" anyway. a top100 time would be "ok" and the rest is lame/beginner/fucked up.

Once again, from that perspective it's not a bad idea. No way to get 54 WC unless you're a T2000.
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Raven »

according to john's list. AH would be 1.18 at least in that list..
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Grace »

I'd be willing to help with Beginner - Good targets, as i've had years of experience in all of these regions :)
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Mawane »

according to john's post, i wonder how many WC targets people would have :D
post your amount here
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Igge »

Please don't. Let's not have this discussion drowned in a target bango spam flood.
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by nick-o-matic »

John's list looks pretty nice, the highest target is good to be that high no matter what you call it (WC or 1337). I think hard WCs will boost WR-hoyling up because nowdays some people just hoyl for the WC target and then move to the next level. In future after getting the WC you could hoyl to the WR too with not so much extra effort. Also if you failed getting WR though you really tried a WC target would become nice booby prize.

Anyway with those times WC TT will go down with some 2 minutes and therefore Pro targets should go too etc. So if we want to keep beginners as beginners as they are now we need more targets to the nab side if not to the pro side (1337).
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Lukazz »

John wrote: 31. 1.13.50
share style first! you can't make WC target requiring a style that ppl don't know :<

i have zero WC in john's list btw. =/
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Madness »

John wrote:46. 53.00
Hard one.

:D
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by John »

Lukazz wrote:
John wrote: 31. 1.13.50
share style first! you can't make WC target requiring a style that ppl don't know :<

i have zero WC in john's list btw. =/
Why not? A time is a time, I'm not obliged to share it just because there is a gap. Like I said, who said everyone should be able to drive a WC just because they want to? WC should seriously threaten WR.

And Madness, I meant 54.00 of course :)

Edit: I would have 29 WC on my own list btw. There's many levels where I'm no threat to the wr with my current times hence not WC.
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Lee »

please none of this 1337 crap. if there must be a new target level atleast call it Elite or Master, not 1337.
John wrote:WC should seriously threaten WR.
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by milagros »

i'm experienced only in 06 atm so i think the wc target should be like 30,40
if targets are pushed to these limits, they become completely useless - you simply check your position in top10 and that tells you if it's decent and you see how many (milli)secs it's from wr
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by pawq »

i kinda agree with mila, but id change his targets a litel
top10 - world class
top75 - pro
top150 - good
top300 - ok
top500 - beginner
;))
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by John »

I can stretch as far as calling Top10 World Class just like that but Top75 is far from Pro...
Anyway, there are so many opinions about where the limits should be that organizing the work with new targets could take forever. The fact remains, current targets are worth bajs so please stop using them!
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Morgan »

Code: Select all

Target times in Elasto Mania. Version 1.3 FINAL.
i think there will be never final version of targets, then stop incerasing and using them ;)
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Mawane »

it will be version 2.0 :P
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Kopaka »

just go back the first one and stop changing them!
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Zweq »

ok just create a new target above world class called MEGAPRO with mega hard targets, that'll do it
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by adi »

John´s list looks pretty nice. Those wc targets would be challenge for anyone just like it´s supposed to be imo. Sure other targets could go down too and ez add 2 more targets like nom mentioned.

Now I often feel that good time means total shit, pro = boring, wc = good and that´s wrong :P. One new target could be decent between OK and good targets. Now there is quite big gap between pro and good targets but I think it´s not so bad thing. I liked the challenge as a nab (for example hoyling Pipe few weeks to get Pro target and top 100 position).

maybe something like this:

WC tt: 38:09 -> 36:1x
pro tt: 39:48 -> 37 high
good tt: 43:16 -> 40-41
decent tt: 43
OK tt: ...

Btw I would have 2 wc times in John´s list.
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Bismuth »

TT -> OK :D
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Grace »

6 - Pro
37 - Good
11 - OK

Zig-Zag -> Good
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by roope »

Good target tt. woo.
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Grace »

7 - Pro
35 - Good
11 - OK

Slalom -> Pro
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Morgan »

worse than wc targets in my opinion(professional or whatever):

01 . - 14,12
02 . - 15,50
03 . - 18,00
04 . - 30,50
05 . - 20,50
06 . - 32,50
07 . - 34,20
08 . - 21,20
09 . - 1,00,00
10 . - 12,00
11 . - 25,00
12 . - 21,80
13 . - 15,00
14 . - 18,10
15 . - 58,00
16 . - 1,30,00
17 . - 56,00
18 . - 45,80
19 . - 39,00
20 . - 1,04,00
21 . - 14,90
22 . - 40,50
23 . - 40,00
24 . - 54,00
25 . - 25,00
26 . - 24,50
27 . - 36,50
28 . - 53,00
29 . - 47,00
30 . - 33,50
31 . - 1,21,00
32 . - 43,70
33 . - 1,05,00
34 . - 38,00
35 . - 2,26,00
36 . - 1,00,00
37 . - 57,50
38 . - 31,00
39 . - 41,50
40 . - 1,27,00
41 . - 40,00
42 . - 50,00
43 . - 58,50
44 . - 12,00
45 . - 33,00
46 . - 60,00
47 . - 21,00
48 . - 51,00
49 . - 40,00
50 . - 57,00
51 . - 45,00
52 . - 25,40
53 . - 17,50
54 . - 1,35,00

what do you think?
Image TT - 36:53.16 || 17 Polish Records || SPEED
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Lukazz
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Lukazz »

ye looks pretty good
TT: 36:59:53 || Avg TT: 38:09:65
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Bismuth
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Bismuth »

Maybe more targets too, like "WC, Pro, Excellent, Good, OK, Fair, Beginner, Total nab". Don't forget people with 45+ TT!

Example, for WU:
WC: 14.06
Pro: 14.12
Excellent: 14.18
Good: 14.30
OK: 14.50
Fair: 14.75
Beginner: 15.10
Total nab: 16.50
:mrhat:
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Lee
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Lee »

nonono, too many to remember. keep it simple
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Bismuth
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Bismuth »

The problem is sometimes, especially with the beginner/OK targets, the gap between them is extremely wide, and I think tighter ones would be more motivating for new players. For example, let's say I have 1:08.92 in Fruit in the Den, moving to 1:02.xx is like "OMFG what?". If the good target was like 1:05.00 and Excellent 1:02.00, then it'd be more motivating to push a little to reach that 1:05.00.

Edit: Plus, usually, your times should not stretch over more than 4 targets, 5 max, so I don't think having more targets under pro would affect much people on that point. I mean, if you have 16.30 on Warm Up and 2:16 in Lab Pro, there's something weird. Of course, Total nab, fair, etc. would not change anything for people with 40 TT and under, I think it'd be positive for those who have 41+, and especially 45-55.
:mrhat:
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Xiphias
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Xiphias »

Since we are at the brainstorming, Why don't we just do it like this?

Code: Select all

PRO LEVEL IN %				
Warm Up			Flat Track	
100	14,00		100	15,00
99	14,02		99	15,03
98	14,04		98	15,06
97	14,06		97	15,09
96	14,08		96	15,12
95	14,10		95	15,15
94	14,12		94	15,18
93	14,14		93	15,21
92	14,16		92	15,24
91	14,18		91	15,27
90	14,20		90	15,30
89	14,22		89	15,33
88	14,24		88	15,36
87	14,26		87	15,39
86	14,28		86	15,42
85	14,30		85	15,45
84	14,32		84	15,48
83	14,34		83	15,51
82	14,36		82	15,54
81	14,38		81	15,57
80	14,40		80	15,60
79	14,42		79	15,63
78	14,44		78	15,66
77	14,46		77	15,69
76	14,48		76	15,72
75	14,50		75	15,75
74	14,52		74	15,78
73	14,54		73	15,81
72	14,56		72	15,84
71	14,58		71	15,87
70	14,60		70	15,90
69	14,62		69	15,93
68	14,64		68	15,96
67	14,66		67	15,99
66	14,68		66	16,02
65	14,70		65	16,05
64	14,72		64	16,08
63	14,74		63	16,11
62	14,76		62	16,14
61	14,78		61	16,17
60	14,80		60	16,20
59	14,82		59	16,23
58	14,84		58	16,26
57	14,86		57	16,29
56	14,88		56	16,32
55	14,90		55	16,35
54	14,92		54	16,38
53	14,94		53	16,41
52	14,96		52	16,44
51	14,98		51	16,47
50	15,00		50	16,50
49	15,02		49	16,53
48	15,04		48	16,56
47	15,06		47	16,59
46	15,08		46	16,62
45	15,10		45	16,65
44	15,12		44	16,68
43	15,14		43	16,71
42	15,16		42	16,74
41	15,18		41	16,77
40	15,20		40	16,80
39	15,22		39	16,83
38	15,24		38	16,86
37	15,26		37	16,89
36	15,28		36	16,92
35	15,30		35	16,95
34	15,32		34	16,98
33	15,34		33	17,01
32	15,36		32	17,04
31	15,38		31	17,07
30	15,40		30	17,10
29	15,42		29	17,13
28	15,44		28	17,16
27	15,46		27	17,19
26	15,48		26	17,22
25	15,50		25	17,25
24	15,52		24	17,28
23	15,54		23	17,31
22	15,56		22	17,34
21	15,58		21	17,37
20	15,60		20	17,40
19	15,62		19	17,43
18	15,64		18	17,46
17	15,66		17	17,49
16	15,68		16	17,52
15	15,70		15	17,55
14	15,72		14	17,58
13	15,74		13	17,61
12	15,76		12	17,64
11	15,78		11	17,67
10	15,80		10	17,70
9	15,82		9	17,73
8	15,84		8	17,76
7	15,86		7	17,79
6	15,88		6	17,82
5	15,90		5	17,85
4	15,92		4	17,88
3	15,94		3	17,91
2	15,96		2	17,94
1	15,98		1	17,97
0	16,00		0	18,00
So for instance.. I got a 14,21 time on Warm Up (89%) and a 16,52 time on flat track (49%) and so in average you have (89%+49%)/2= 69% PRO LEVEL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! awesome isn't it? xD Instead of saying how many wc you got xD So getting 100% would be like collecting all of the Hidden Packages in Grand Theft Auto ;D nice goal

OR

Give points or procentage for each Target you manage to beat.
WC 100
PRO 80
Good 60
Ok 40
Beginner 20

So for instance someone has 4 WC, 15 Pro, 24 Good, 11 Ok times.
(4*100+15*80+24*60+11*40)/54 = 64,44%

OMG HE HAS 64% PRO LEVEL ON INTERNALS.. AWESOME

no seriously.. please do some last update on the target list just like from 1,2 to 1,3 for the EOL release and .. that's it. No more changes. Who wants to lose their target times every month.. or each wr update as some have suggested?
Thorze wrote:I just wanted to make a cool topic like Juish have cool topics..
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Bismuth
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Re: Target List Personal Stats

Post by Bismuth »

I love your idea, Xiph, having like %. In longer levs, the gaps would not be that wide and that is nice. For example, in Lab Pro, we could have like 2:12, :13, :14, :15 ... 3:52, maybe 1.20 or 1.30 though, since 0% for 3:52 is maybe too harsh, especially is its equivalent is warm up 16.00. Anyway, I suggest - maybe - minus percents, for example, in Warm Up: 14.00 = 100%, 15.00 = 0%, 16.00 = -100%. In... let's say, Hill Legend, 14.00 = 100%, 19.00 = 0%, 24.00 = -100%. Framework: 38,50 = 100%, 47.50 = 0%, 56.50 = -100%. In Lab Pro, 2:14 = 100%, 3:29 = 0%, 4:44 = -100%. These are just suggestions, though.
:mrhat:
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