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 Post subject: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 25 Jan 2016, 20:10 
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Kuski
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SEASON 1



Rules:


3 leagues, 12 man per league.

11 matches, one match per second day. Start 31. January 20.59 (gmt +2). This means after each match there is a break day.

A match consist of 2 levels released at the same time. You have 24 H after the levels are released to beat your opponents time.

Same 2 levels for all 3 leagues

A match is 1vs1 in same league, people will be set up in a list.

If a player win 2-0 of the levs over the other player he win 3 point. If 1-1 both get 1 point, and if lose all, 0 point. If one player doesnt show up he lose. If both players dont show up, 1 point each.
In rare situations where the time of two opponents are the same in a level, this counts as a draw in this level. The one that win in the other level will then win that match.

Players will be set up in estimated leagues.

The two players in the bottom and the top of a league will progress to next league or degress to the lesser league in the next season.

The winner of the premier league wins 10 euro.

The levels will be posted in the second post of this thread (the post below this one) when a match start, the post made by carryheart(Vadik).
If not on Vadiks post, it will be posted on first post



Standings Season 1

Standings after tenth match:

Image


Scoreboard
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Calendar

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Every match starts 21.00 (GMT +2 (finnish time)) and lasts 24 hours.

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Last edited by Polarix on 21 Feb 2016, 21:50, edited 46 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 25 Jan 2016, 20:17 
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Kuski
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Location: Ekaterinburg
ATTENTION!!! 10th MATCHES STARTS!!!
ALL TWO LEVELS FOR ALL 3 LEAGUES
DEADLINE TODAY IN 24 HOURS
mood: np : Purity Ring - Begin Again.mp3 (320kbps) - 3:26
BEGIN AGAIN BEGIN AGAIN BEGIN AGAIN....
p.s prosto papin brodyaga, mamin simpotyaga
p.s.2: father`s roamer, mother`s cute guy
P.S.3: mur mur mur azazazaza.


Attachments:
TEL011b.lev [3.41 KiB]
Downloaded 44 times
TEL011a.lev [4.71 KiB]
Downloaded 37 times


Last edited by carryheart on 20 Feb 2016, 19:13, edited 20 times in total.
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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 25 Jan 2016, 20:22 
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Kuski
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Joined: 29 Oct 2015, 14:14
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Location: Ekaterinburg
Premier League
1st League
2nd League


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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 25 Jan 2016, 20:26 
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Kuski
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carryheart wrote:
good idea. we needs 12 players in every league.
maybe start in 1 february?


1 february too soon, need to fill the legues with players

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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 25 Jan 2016, 20:40 
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Kuski
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Good idea, but from my experience it's almost impossible to get people playing at the same time on regular basis.

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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 26 Jan 2016, 00:00 
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3 group is not enough, also 12 mans per group is way too many. Would be better with 5-6 mans in group and as many groups as possible. I think there should be an event (like an 1 day event on a ~30-50 secs lev) which decides groups and mans who are in which league. So if 30 player comes into the event, there would be 5 groups with 6ppl each. I think no need 1v1 plays, everyone in same league could höyl one or X lev from group (so 1 or x lev/group), after levs ended (if more levels in a group then total time counts) the first 2 going up to higher league, 2 stays there and the last 2 going down a group. If someone doesnt show up in first event, he could still join if want to the last group until first normal event starts. This could continue like 10 events and after that we could see the league winner.

These are advices, but would be more fun this way i think.

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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 26 Jan 2016, 21:12 
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Kuski
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Joined: 28 May 2007, 08:47
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i would like to play

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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 26 Jan 2016, 21:26 
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Kuski
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So for example
Premier League
1. Bjenn
2. Kazan

3. Zero
4. Markku
5. finman
6. Madness
7. Ville_J
8. Zweq
9. adi
10. Pab
11. talli
12. Leek


1st match. 1 february 2016:
Bjenn vs Kazan
Zero vs Markku
finman vs Madness
Ville_J vs Zweq
adi vs Pab
talli vs Leek

1st League
1. roope
2. Blaz

3. Luther
4. gimp
5. Kiiwi
6. Ramone
7. Labs
8. Nekit
9. Orcc
10. Tm
11. Mielz
12. Mira


1st match:
etc. same as PL
...
...

2nd League
1. icwiener
2. DIvAn

3. Mz
4. TarGEnoR
5. RearNakedChoke
6. vadik
7. Polarix
8. Mrrr
9. Chaza
10. ILKKA
11. Kokso17
12. Koo


Who wants to play or not write in this topic or pm in irc. i go to change :3
Well looks will be quite funny :c


Last edited by carryheart on 30 Jan 2016, 17:22, edited 6 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 26 Jan 2016, 21:29 
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Kuski
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Joined: 29 Oct 2015, 14:14
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then 2nd match will be 2nd of february; 3rd match on 3rd february etc..
we will update table every week on sunday


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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 26 Jan 2016, 21:33 
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Kuski
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I'd enjoy playing. :beer:

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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 26 Jan 2016, 21:33 
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Kuski
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guys if u have some not big levels to event -> send it. need two levels every day :3
we would say very much thanks to you o,o :3


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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 26 Jan 2016, 22:06 
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Yes sounds fun and I would play, but my premier league time would have been over 10 years ago

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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 26 Jan 2016, 22:30 
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Kuski
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Polarix wrote:
Rules:

3 leagues, 12 man per league.

11 matches, one match every sunday from 00.00-->23.59 starting: February maybe?

A match consist of 2 levels released at the same time 00.00-->23.59 on each sunday


Just so I understand this correctly, we get 24 hours to hoyl two levels? What would be better imo is to give a whole week to play, and release next two levs again the following Sunday. Having two people play two levels every Sunday with only 24 hours to submit just isn't gonna happen. Especially when I don't think a lot of these players even know they are in the competition?

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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 26 Jan 2016, 22:36 
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Kuski
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it will be beta testing event for 1month :3
starts 01.02.2016
ends 01.03.2016


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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 26 Jan 2016, 22:40 
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Kuski
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Joined: 29 Oct 2015, 14:14
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gimp wrote:
Polarix wrote:
Rules:

3 leagues, 12 man per league.

11 matches, one match every sunday from 00.00-->23.59 starting: February maybe?

A match consist of 2 levels released at the same time 00.00-->23.59 on each sunday


Just so I understand this correctly, we get 24 hours to hoyl two levels? What would be better imo is to give a whole week to play, and release next two levs again the following Sunday. Having two people play two levels every Sunday with only 24 hours to submit just isn't gonna happen. Especially when I don't think a lot of these players even know they are in the competition?



no. i think it will looks much more interesting if guys will play 1 day - 2 levels;
and not hoyl 1 week as always in similar tournaments...


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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 26 Jan 2016, 22:49 
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Kuski
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okay, what time zone

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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 26 Jan 2016, 22:55 
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Kuski
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+1 time zone.

But I think you will not need to send your time. We will just check database. So just download lev and play.

But first season will just be testing it out and shit.

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Last edited by Polarix on 26 Jan 2016, 22:57, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 26 Jan 2016, 22:56 
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Kuski

Joined: 19 May 2002, 19:13
Posts: 821
An elma league is a good idea, and I think it has potential to conquer a nice long lasting corner from the elma community. I think it is good idea to be clear who is going to host the league, where it is going to be hosted and who are taking part in hosting etc. I been hosting some tournaments on some other games, so I'm also kinda interested.

I'll throw in my first feel suggestions:

- league would be more like an ongoing thing, just like real leagues, and not something that is going to end in one month, so it would last more like one year
- league would have multiple divisions with relegations and promotions periodically (more often than once a year)


a team format league:

20 teams each having x players.

The teams could be restricted to maximum of 3, or 4 or 5 official players. Or maybe even could allow no upper limit for members in a team.

Participation fee: ? Involving money could be possible? 5 eur per team. Each division winner could get something, higher division spot could be valuable etc? Of course no money involvement possible too.

1st division with 10 teams
2nd division with 10 teams

each team will play against another team every sunday. 24h battle on 2 levels. The match could end in draw, win or lose, like Polarix presented. Teams would send in their best rec on both levels.

After 9 weeks every team has played against every team in their division.

The top 4 teams in 1st division will play semi-finals on the 10th week: 1 vs 4, 2 vs 3, and on the 11th week the winners will play the final match.

The winner of the 2nd division will be automatically promoted to the 1st division for the next season. The 10th of the 1st division will be automatically relegated to the 2nd division. The teams ranked 2 to 5 of the 2nd division will play a play-off round against the teams ranked 6 to 9 in 1st division, div1 6th vs div2 5th, div1 7th vs div2 4th and so on. The winners of these games will play on the 1st division on the next season, and the losers will play on the 2nd division.

- This kind of format would allow a long league like type of play, keeping it exciting until the end of the season for the most of the teams (figght for playoff spots and championship etc)

- Even if it is 1vs1, it is actually 3vs3 or 4v4 or 5v5?
- Team forming and exchanging recs and styles is old skool across/elastomania at its best!
- Team play would allow an individual player some breathing room, if they happen to be busy some weeks, a teammate could jump in and take a bigger role
- Players are allowed to change teams until 'trade deadlines' like in hockey or football.
- If this kind of system would gather interest, I or someone could provide a website, where people could easily form teams, or where players could seek for team spots etc. Or where players could communicate privately with their teammates etc.

Any thoughts on this kind of league?


edit: of course can play team league later or separately so no problem, just laying this idea down here :s


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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 26 Jan 2016, 23:24 
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Kuski
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Hm, I like this idea with teams because of the less stress for every individual member.

Only me and Vadik, that is forum member carryheart, are admins / hosters right now. But I have no experience with hosting tournaments, dont know about Vadik. So I like you onlainari to join if you want.

Yes we need some kind of website when the ideas are set and made.

What do you think vadik of teams?, it is less work for the hosters IMO.

And money will be more interesting, but I dont know if all people want that. Maybe we can make a system where you can play with money and win money, and not pay money, but not able to win money.

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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 26 Jan 2016, 23:41 
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Kuski
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Polarix wrote:
Hm, I like this idea with teams because of the less stress for every individual member.

Only me and Vadik, that is forum member carryheart, are admins / hosters right now. But I have no experience with hosting tournaments, dont know about Vadik. So I like you onlainari to join if you want.

Yes we need some kind of website when the ideas are set and made.

What do you think vadik of teams?, it is less work for the hosters IMO.

And money will be more interesting, but I dont know if all people want that. Maybe we can make a system where you can play with money and win money, and not pay money, but not able to win money.


i think not really good idea with the teams because its enough if one team will have one good player. he can plays all levels very well to tt of all team. and not give motivating to play to others ppl in team...

and of course this system in ideally must have some site.


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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 27 Jan 2016, 04:28 
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Kuski
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if you wanted the teams to be fair you would have to say take two members of each league and then make a team of 6 or something. so that you have a team with multiple good, average, and nab players. then maybe make an average time of the best 4 times out of the 6 times or something. maybe too complicated for anybody to bother making happen but i have always thought this idea would be cool. maybe a bit offtopic though for purpose of THIS individual league but i would be all about what onlairnaiar posted, elma always thrives when there is a format that incites good competition for everyone

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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 27 Jan 2016, 07:10 
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Kuski

Joined: 29 Aug 2014, 16:21
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Hi,
I'd also like to participate if there's still place :). Looks like it could be fun


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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 27 Jan 2016, 09:51 
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Kuski
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i really wandere about time zones

guys must starts to play
first match 01.02.2016 00:01 and deadline 01.02.2016 23:59
second match 02.02.2016 00:01 and deadl 02.02.2016 23:59
etc
...
...
...


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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 27 Jan 2016, 09:57 
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Kuski
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would be very nice for me Gulf Standart Time
All times are UTC + 4 hours


what u think about that? o,o


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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 27 Jan 2016, 09:57 
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Kuski

Joined: 19 May 2002, 19:13
Posts: 821
Yeah. Maybe the time is not right for the team thing. I think it needs more planning and teaming up, website etc, so it couldn't be started as early as in begin of february.

Also had another idea for the team league. Instead of 2 levels at the weekend, there could be 1 level, where the team has to send in single player time, and multi player time. So there would be a role for less skilled players to collect some apples when doing the multiplayer with the teams star player. Problem is of course the nuisance, that 2 players from the team has to be online playing at the same time. So less levels to be made, but the result could still be a win, loss or a draw, 2-0 or 1-1.

Also was thinking that it could be like a footballs champions league, where they play only one game every 2 weeks, so it could be really slow-paced league, donno.

Also another competition brand in elma could be a slow-paced cup or grand prix, that would copy the format from formula 1 or WRC rally. An almost a year round circuit, with an event every two weeks or so. There could be additional qualifications for the main events. For example the best 10 or 20 players will get automatic entry to next grand prix, while others will play a qualification competition in the odd week when the main event is not held. I like the 24h long "battle" as probably the best option, as it would be fair for all timezones. The next best option imo would be something shorter, like 12h or even an one hour battle.

Or in more WRC style, an event would include e.g. 2-3 stages (2-3 levels in 1h battle) qualification, and the total time of that would determine the standings. Then top players from 2 different qualifications would enter the main event 24h battle. The stages could be played 2-3 days in a row, so you could see your progress in the standings after the 1st stage, like in rally. In this format we would want to have 2 separate qualifications for 2 different timezones. Could be divided to eastern and western qualification conferences, and participants could tell which timezone they would prefer for the 1 hour battle.

But for that kind of grand prix format also, I would find it important to have an own website and good amount of time to advertise it first to make it succesful.

edit: About that team forming. Yeah that is also another issue in the team format.

Either allow anyone to form any kind of teams with anybody. This would probably create more teams where the team members are around same level with each other, in which case they are likely to co-operate more and have more motivation, as more than one player can generate the best time for the event. This would create difference between teams skills though, but that's what the divisions are for anyway? In football there is Barcelona, and then there are teams like Levante or Gijon or whatever :)

The other option would be to draft teams. Strong players could be assigned as captains, and then a "standard draft" or an "auction draft" would be held. In standard, captains would take turns picking players to their teams, and in auction, a set of play money would be handed to the captains, and then there would be auction on every available player turn by turn, and who bids the most on a player gets it.

This team thing does sound good on paper, but it has its problems, so I don't know.


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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 27 Jan 2016, 13:57 
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38mins club
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Orka read all of that :) Maybe you guys could just discuss all the stuff on IRC or somewhere, lauta is not so ideal for discussing details.

I will just wait for one official post with all the rules.

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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 27 Jan 2016, 14:07 
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Kuski
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1 on 1 kind of competitions is something that has been tried a number of times before, but there's some issues with that in elma. It's an interesting format inspired by other sports, but unlike professional sport tournaments elma participation is based solely on motivation to play, which means you always see a somewhat large decline in number of people playing a contest from first to last event. Point being if people are paired 1 on 1 there are likely to be many pairs where one doesn't play or plays very little in comparison so there's no real competition.

Another thing is having same level in different pairs creates a kind of weird situation, where you may lose your match up, but have a better time than someone who won his, so you still get less points than that person. That's the nature of match ups, but when elma isn't a sport where you play directly against each other and all is playing the same level it seems odd. One fix would be different levels but that's just way too many levels required.

Teams have same issues with team mates stopping playing, but also the added social aspect of having to find a team. Just looking at multi battles in EOL, you'll often see people trying to multiplay with themselves rather than try to team up with someone. Also if you're talking five players in a team, just two divisions with 10 teams is 100 people, which is quite rare in an elma contest.

I don't mean to be just negative, I just think you should learn from previous competitions. It's interesting to take inspiration from other sports, but you need to remember how elma works. Some sort of league contest is something I've always wanted to do, so it's nice to see tried again, the more we do it the better chance we have of finding a good way to do it. What I think would work better is having everyone in same division play against everyone in each event and give points like in a cup, X events and then promote/relegate and new season. Then there's room for some people who stop playing, they'll relegate or you just remove them and promote more people. And you can even have skips.

24 hour events could work well, because timezones doesn't matter then, everyone will have a full day. Though you might feel a bit presured to have to play all day.

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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 29 Jan 2016, 00:26 
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Kuski
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I think the closest "real thing" we had was when sirevilx whatshisname tried to make elma league way back. Problem back then was that there were way too few people willing to make levels, and too many players (because no EOL or anything back then, not even irc ballebot I think at the time). This might be the other way around now; easier to get people contributing levels, and way fewer people playing nowadays. Which initially might sound like a good problem to have, but I think you'll still run into the same problem as Kopaka mentioned. It's fun at the start as a concept, but interest will probably die off slowly, and maybe a bit exponentially as less and less people play.

I think to even have something going for more than a couple of weeks, you'd need to make a proper nice site for it and add some kind of gamification; a goal or some kind of carrot to keep people playing even if they end up losing a bit and stuff like that. Being able to see lots of stats, progression etc. And maybe have a bit longer time period, something in between one-day battle and total time cup. It'd be really cool if it became popular, but I think it'll be really hard. Even more so if you're just making results and stuff through mopolauta.

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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 29 Jan 2016, 00:29 
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Kuski
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Maybe going further than just making something inbetween... actually making a site where it's not only a league with relegation and groups, but maybe even have some kind of playoffs, double elimination brackets and a "finals" of sorts. Maybe even have some mini-total time cup events every now and then where you're only competing your total time vs the other person, which again could count to your stats etc in some way. Duno.

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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 29 Jan 2016, 09:13 
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Ville_J vs Zweq 8D ok 2 dificult! i giv up! hants up!

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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 29 Jan 2016, 09:47 
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Zweq wrote:
Ville_J vs Zweq 8D ok 2 dificult! i giv up! hants up!


never giv up zweq o,o


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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 29 Jan 2016, 09:56 
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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 29 Jan 2016, 15:56 
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38mins club
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Altho you guys didnt give a fuck on my advices, i want to play.

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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 29 Jan 2016, 16:19 
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35mins club
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I will play whenever I can! But for the love of god, no shown times, that's just redarted.

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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 29 Jan 2016, 20:46 
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Kuski
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Kokso wrote:
Hi,
I'd also like to participate if there's still place :). Looks like it could be fun


kk kokso. u will in second league


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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 29 Jan 2016, 20:47 
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Kuski
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Labs wrote:
Altho you guys didnt give a fuck on my advices, i want to play.

oke u in first league Labs o,o


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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 29 Jan 2016, 20:58 
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Kuski
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Joined: 13 Feb 2007, 11:14
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I'm going to play

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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 30 Jan 2016, 02:45 
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39mins club

Joined: 29 Dec 2002, 19:17
Posts: 1517
Location: Bratislava, Slovakia
Just make a website for ppl to sign up, then divide them into leagues or sach, ez.

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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 30 Jan 2016, 17:05 
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Kuski
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Joined: 29 Oct 2015, 14:14
Posts: 30
Location: Ekaterinburg
so guys about timezone: it will in finland 20:59 deadline and starts 21:01 every match
All times are UTC + 4 hours!!!
because this timezone very nice for me
well o,o


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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 30 Jan 2016, 17:18 
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Kuski

Joined: 21 Mar 2005, 14:30
Posts: 6
Location: Budapest
I will play! :)

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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 30 Jan 2016, 17:58 
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Kuski
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Joined: 15 Dec 2011, 01:07
Posts: 301
Location: Norway
Interesting ideas. I will pay attention when things are more settled. :)

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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 31 Jan 2016, 05:22 
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Kuski
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Joined: 28 May 2007, 08:47
Posts: 922
this competition starts on February 2nd at 0000 Gulf Standard Time, correct?

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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 31 Jan 2016, 08:32 
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Kuski
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Joined: 29 Oct 2015, 14:14
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Location: Ekaterinburg
gimp wrote:
this competition starts on February 2nd at 0000 Gulf Standard Time, correct?


this competition starts today 21:01 in finland time; 22:01 in moscow time; dont know about other countries


Last edited by carryheart on 31 Jan 2016, 17:22, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 31 Jan 2016, 11:11 
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Kuski
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Joined: 29 Oct 2015, 14:14
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Location: Ekaterinburg
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Last edited by carryheart on 1 Feb 2016, 09:41, edited 3 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 31 Jan 2016, 11:27 
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38mins club
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Joined: 2 May 2005, 14:20
Posts: 910
Location: Hungary
Check again first league first matches, i think i'm against kiiwi in that system.

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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 31 Jan 2016, 11:31 
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Kuski
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Joined: 29 Oct 2015, 14:14
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Location: Ekaterinburg
Labs wrote:
Check again first league first matches, i think i'm against kiiwi in that system.


yea updated...


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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 31 Jan 2016, 15:00 
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38mins club
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Joined: 2 May 2005, 14:20
Posts: 910
Location: Hungary
Since no real rules written in one place i did search for 'em...

1. Play online, no need to send in recs.
2. 2 levs each second day (one day event, one day break, one day event etc.), starting jan 31, 21:00 finnish time until next day 21:00.
3. 2 levs per league event
4. Your opponent is visible on table which carryheart (Vadik) included some posts up.
5. Ye it's 1v1, so you get one opponent from your league (check table) per event.
6. You get 3 points if you win the day against your opponent, 1 if draw.
7. After the 22 days there will be a new round (dunno when), the first 2 from your league going up and the last 2 going down a league.
8. Results showing up every sunday?

Edited numerous times.

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Last edited by Labs on 1 Feb 2016, 03:14, edited 4 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 31 Jan 2016, 15:10 
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36mins club

Joined: 27 Jan 2009, 22:21
Posts: 281
Location: Poland
Im in the list of players i see now, duno how, if even havent heard about the event before. If its 11 days every day from now on, its totally retarded idea. Would be oke maybe if 1 event every weekend, not many mans can hoyl so much when some random asks you to. For example im in the middle of exam session now and wont do much more than just few random balles.

So tl;dl if daily events, gz everyone who participates vs me for win already, fu noob organisation bye

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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 31 Jan 2016, 15:55 
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Kuski
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Joined: 29 Oct 2015, 14:14
Posts: 30
Location: Ekaterinburg
Mielz wrote:
Im in the list of players i see now, duno how, if even havent heard about the event before. If its 11 days every day from now on, its totally retarded idea. Would be oke maybe if 1 event every weekend, not many mans can hoyl so much when some random asks you to. For example im in the middle of exam session now and wont do much more than just few random balles.

So tl;dl if daily events, gz everyone who participates vs me for win already, fu noob organisation bye


yes Mielz a bit right
oke - it will be 1 day play and one day break
so - first match deadline in 2nd february ; then break 1 day and - 2nd match will starts in the 3rd of february


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 Post subject: Re: The elma leagues
PostPosted: 31 Jan 2016, 17:32 
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39mins club

Joined: 29 Dec 2002, 19:17
Posts: 1517
Location: Bratislava, Slovakia
I already told them to make a website so ppl can sign up there. This way ppl who don't want to play or have no time won't be included and ppl who want to play and aren't included will be.

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