Enigma Bounce

Marvin · Post by **Marvin** » 16 May 2006, 21:38

Very nice recs, both of them.

The fact remains: without a definition there is no way to tell if these are bug bounces or not. As long as it's not one of those fly-all-over-the-level-bugs as we've seen in lvl 12 for example, it's ok with me.

enil · Post by **enil** » 16 May 2006, 21:41

its not a bug, imo stinis is more buggy.. look at the bike after the bounce. stini is like an ekplotion, while luther is more like a push

Post by **Abula** » 17 May 2006, 00:27

How about this:

Let's legimate all bug bounces in Enigma, but only in Enigma. Ehm.. and in Pipe! and and... blah only in Enigma.

It could be the only dope-free level where people were allowed to use their mega tuning skills to produce the most giant bounces ever. And the WR would go for the greatest bug bouncer .. as it might have been gone for some years already (not my personal opinion). But then there just wouldn't be this px factor anymore.

Throughout the history people have got bug bounces in their records. I know at least Hang Tight (WR), Apple Harvest, Labyrinth Pro (WR). In those levels the bounce isn't so crusial and thereby it never become a big issue.

Hm, so. How will be the first under 19secs? 18?

Post by **SveinR** » 17 May 2006, 00:34

Jalli wrote: Funny you mention Tor's as his bounce has same power as Stini's...
Stini just bounces at lower point in hill by pressing right volt...

Agree. To me Stini's doesn't look like a bug bounce at all, and frankly, I cannot understand how people can deem Luther's as legit, and Stini's as not. Just merge them.

Zweq · Post by **Zweq** » 17 May 2006, 00:44

Abula wrote:How about this:

Let's legimate all bug bounces in Enigma, but only in Enigma. Ehm.. and in Pipe! and and... blah only in Enigma.

It could be the only dope-free level where people were allowed to use their mega tuning skills to produce the most giant bounces ever. And the WR would go for the greatest bug bouncer .. as it might have been gone for some years already (not my personal opinion). But then there just wouldn't be this px factor anymore.

Throughout the history people have got bug bounces in their records. I know at least Hang Tight (WR), Apple Harvest, Labyrinth Pro (WR). In those levels the bounce isn't so crusial and thereby it never become a big issue.

Hm, so. How will be the first under 19secs? 18?

i dont really like the idea where luck means more than skill, as funny as 18.50 rec would look like. or could you really tune so that you get bugs every now and then ? ;o

sierra · Post by **sierra** » 17 May 2006, 01:28

SveinR wrote:
Jalli wrote: Funny you mention Tor's as his bounce has same power as Stini's...
Stini just bounces at lower point in hill by pressing right volt...
Agree. To me Stini's doesn't look like a bug bounce at all, and frankly, I cannot understand how people can deem Luther's as legit, and Stini's as not. Just merge them.

Fuclk yea , taht's amazing!!! COal recs to merege there
..

Luther's bounc eis just so AWESOME! It's like a punch to the face, it just hits you and you're completely stunned. It's like the coolest display of power ever, hey i can throw this bug bounce at you and see how you fucking like that mate.

Stini's has that same WOW to it. The back wheel just explodes and you fucking feel it, you can feel the acceleration, it's intense. The thrust drags at the pixels on your screen and blurs the eye. It's a vivid release of abnormal algebraic energy.

I say, let these bugs be allowed. Give a shit if they're bu og or not. Obviously good players with good tunes can do them. Stini, Luther and Tor, all in the same team, have each individually got bug bounces in Enigma. You think that's just a coincidence??? You think that's luck? No. ICE is the fucking leetest sickest team in the scene, and regardless of what people like to think of Karlis and Zweq, it is them to best know the software side. Don't just allow these recs. Admire them. This is the epitome of the modern elma record - insanity. This is how high the bar is now raised. If you're good enough, you will do a bounce even harder than theirs. And it won't be because you got lucky, it will be because you are a fucking pro.

Cheaj.

Zweq · Post by **Zweq** » 17 May 2006, 01:46

i just cant admire luck based tricks ;S. even if you can help the bug a bit, in the end you make hundreds of runs just hoping you get a decent bug.

sierra · Post by **sierra** » 17 May 2006, 01:51

But the need to make hundreds of runs is how a wr should be. ffs wrs are too easy these days, all these norwegians finns can make wrs in a few tries, nobody hoyls anymore except the noobs. If all wrs were to the standard of stini's enigma, then people would play hundreds of runs fuck yea then they'd actually accomplish something

Memphis · Post by **Memphis** » 17 May 2006, 02:03

In my opinon almost all the enigma runs are bugged seems like back compression even on 20 second runs is a bit high. I agree with abula on this one though may as well make it a lvl where bug bounces is allowed cause too hard to decide what is and what isn't. Sick rec btw Stini and luther

simon_labroue · Post by **simon_labroue** » 17 May 2006, 02:17

Zweq wrote:i just cant admire luck based tricks ;S

Neither can I.
In my opinion, the bar is so that Stini's bugged. For Luther's, I can't really say.
We should nonetheless legalize all enigma bounces, until we mathematically define legal bounces. and that should be the job of the programmers.

it's up to them to mathematically define legal bounces...
what can they say on this subject? I'm kinda interested...

Sunday, 30 May 2004
WRs - at 22:08 EET by px
Two new WRs added. Lately, there's been lots of talk about bounces. Obviously, some kind of line between acceptable and unacceptable has to be defined. This definition should occur in near future.

Honza · Post by **Honza** » 17 May 2006, 05:24

If this (bug)bounce would be ridden to record by non-scandinavish kuski it would be considered as a BUG and record wouldn't allowed.
but, scandinavian can make bug times as much as he want.

skint0r · Post by **skint0r** » 17 May 2006, 05:46

Epsilon reincarnated as Honza?

Are · Post by **Are** » 17 May 2006, 08:42

Neither of the bounces look buggy to me. At least not compared to some of the earlier versions of the Enigma-bounce

teajay · Post by **teajay** » 17 May 2006, 08:43

Honza, that's the most ignorant thing to say about this issue, sheesh.

OtorK · Post by **OtorK** » 17 May 2006, 08:45

And what about unknow (non-scandivian?) player? If you remember Ded's Flattrack... Ded would probably never got his WR, if mila wasn't agitate for him so much... I guess some unknown non snandivian wouldn't get that wr, if he had driven same ride as Stini back then

So I think Honza's sentence isn't nonsense at all.

Anyway, in my opinion Luther's rec seems more buggy than Stini's

, I can't get comments like this:

simon_labroue wrote:so remove stini's wr from the list, then put luther's time there.

Luther · Post by **Luther** » 17 May 2006, 09:55

The kuskis who played enigma and have some form of skill, get to the bounce maybe 75% (even more) of the runs, of course youll get a mega good bounce some time with some luck :X you would be unlucky if you didnt, or if youre unaware of and cant feel what a good tune is, etc

culinko · Post by **culinko** » 17 May 2006, 10:13

i have an idea: wont accept any kind of enigma bounce and go back to an old 40x.xx style

Luther · Post by **Luther** » 17 May 2006, 10:14

CuLiNo wrote:i have an idea: wont accept any kind of enigma bounce and go back to an old 40x.xx style

thatd be something indeed! =)

8-ball · Post by **8-ball** » 17 May 2006, 12:52

I say don't allow bug bounces in general BUT allow certain tricks that may be bugged. For example, Enigma and Pipe. A noob just can't make a perfect tune for those bounces. So I kind of fucking agree with Sierra.

Dynamo · Post by **Dynamo** » 17 May 2006, 12:55

Well it sounds stupid to allow bug bounces on one lev...this issue is becoming frustrating, like we should've just kept our mouths shut about these recs from the start...

1) This problem most likely won't be fixed unless someone busts their ass to make a decent prog

2) I'm starting to wonder if bounces all together should be allowed, like wtf think about it, its okay to get a powerful bounce that makes the kuski more mobile, to reach impsy places, but its not okay to get a lucky one thats 'nat far cuz nobody else would have that luck', thats just stupid lol

A.K.B. · Post by **A.K.B.** » 17 May 2006, 13:32

Stini wrote:I was asked to write here, but honestly I don't know what I should say.
I don't know if Luther's rec is a bug. I think I'm not the person to talk about legitimacy of bounces, if anyone is. All that I can say is that in my opinion my bounce is less buggy, but as seen in this thread, there are many opinions and no actual line between a bug and a normal bounce, so we really can do nothing but speculate. Well seriously I have nothing wise to say, BUT I made my notorious WR in Enigma 16 May 2004, so that means today is its birthday \o/. And guess what would a good way to celebrate it? Yes, that's right:

PLZ DON'T DLOAD

Enjoy.

That's my sisters birthday as well!

Juble · Post by **Juble** » 18 May 2006, 04:47

I see more boarderline bounces in #battle on a regular basis.

that looks like skill. luth.... crazy

stini's is a bug in my opinion. looks like luck.

but engima is a lev i havent really played. So my opinion doesnt really count.

wwwDotcoM · Post by **wwwDotcoM** » 1 Aug 2006, 11:25

to me stini's bounce seems like every succesfull labpro bounce i've made or seen - not bug teh

jaytea · Post by **jaytea** » 1 Aug 2006, 15:43

wwwDotcoM wrote:to me stini's bounce seems like every succesfull labpro bounce i've made or seen - not bug teh

ye but you have more speed in lab pro bunce

petsen · Post by **petsen** » 1 Aug 2006, 15:59

I have doubts about stinis too, but luthers simply should not be allowed. Cant see HOW that rec ever came to the toplists!!! sorry luth nothin personal

Xiphias · Post by **Xiphias** » 1 Aug 2006, 18:05

well imo it's not about the wheels... how much they "bug" (instant move) but more how much speed the bike gets.

petsen · Post by **petsen** » 1 Aug 2006, 19:09

well if u check bug recs in general, the more the wheel flitches out of place the more speed they get...

Xiphias · Post by **Xiphias** » 1 Aug 2006, 19:23

acutally not..

u can ez have monster wheel movement... and the bike stands still.

SO...

petsen · Post by **petsen** » 2 Nov 2006, 17:10

J-sim wrote:stinis is kind of easier to judge because it in no way looks like an ordinary bounce. luthers does look like an ordinary "buggish" bounce because of the wheelpop. but it surely still is questionable. but in stinis bounce he doesn't even get pressure on the hill as far as i remember, he just suddenly gets skyrocketed.

how can it be questionable???

the wheel pops like a bug.... thats all there is too it... whether or not he gains speed its still a bug... that kind of bug is seen in all kinds of "omgbug.rec" .. even ciphs rec on hooked (17,9x) when wr was 18.0x.. bugs in the exact same way and wasnt legal... this hypocrizy is so ridicoulous

http://up.k10x.net/ryolretcvnvwb/53wr.rec <- ciphs rec