I have insider information regarding Elasto Mania

General discussion about the games and the scene.

Moderator: Moporators

User avatar
SveinR
Moporator
Posts: 5469
Joined: 21 May 2002, 08:05
Location: Oslo, Norway
Contact:

Post by SveinR »

Clearly, the information SlenderBelly is giving us is true. Just look at Abula's posts, hell, simply look at the sincerity of Slender's own posts regarding the issue.

Anyway, it's long past time to stop the constand bickering over SlenderBelly, and instead, perhaps, we could begin discussing this new version of ElastoMania that Balazs is working on.
Was it cast for the mass who burn and toil?
Or for the vultures who thirst for blood and oil?
Rules | FAQ
Epsilon
Kuski
Posts: 365
Joined: 22 Aug 2002, 22:13
Location: Haifa, Israel
Contact:

Post by Epsilon »

if balazs didn't mean that this info will spread, i think we should just wait silently until it comes out and not have a big talk about it.
Epsilon | TT : 45:42,82 | Elma Around the World | Smile levpack
User avatar
Abula
Moposite admin
Posts: 4449
Joined: 16 May 2002, 23:00
Team: FM
Location: Helsinki
Contact:

Post by Abula »

Balá is aware of this thread.
40:02,71 (151.) | WCup4: 8. | 3x WR | 3x GAA | 11x FEM | KOM | The History of Elasto Mania (1995-2018)
User avatar
dz
first 39tt
Posts: 3749
Joined: 19 May 2002, 15:16
Team: FM
Location: Finland
Contact:

Post by dz »

New version, I'm getting excited!
MJXII
Kuski
Posts: 336
Joined: 19 May 2002, 17:58
Location: sleeping

Post by MJXII »

Hope it works the same on all computers and settings :)
User avatar
Juski
Kuski
Posts: 2200
Joined: 26 Dec 2003, 20:53
Location: irc://irc.ircnet.org/ranks

Post by Juski »

I hope not, then there will be no tuning, like profesionals in different sports wasnt allowed to select any of their gear:/ my opinion atleast.
No regrets Image
Are you LOST?
User avatar
Kopaka
39mins club
Posts: 6610
Joined: 23 May 2002, 13:59
Team: LAME
Location: In a northern danish city beating YOUR record.
Contact:

Post by Kopaka »

Does any games work exact the same on all computers/settings ? I guess nat.
Phillip
Kuski
Posts: 95
Joined: 12 Sep 2002, 14:59
Team: TP

Post by Phillip »

Kopaka wrote:Does any games work exact the same on all computers/settings ? I guess nat.
It is possible to make a game's physics independent of framerate, but this is not the usual way to do it. Usually you do a certain number of physics updates per frame, which makes the result dependant on framerate (the result of a numerical integration depends on the length of the "steps").

The frame rate independant way to do it is certainly possible, you just decide on a certain integration step length. (You would of course have to delay each update to make sure the game runs at the correct speed)
SpeaK
Kuski
Posts: 88
Joined: 23 Feb 2004, 16:46
Location: Finland
Contact:

Post by SpeaK »

Well Philip, Elma IS independent of framerate. There are other factors than just framerate.
Phillip
Kuski
Posts: 95
Joined: 12 Sep 2002, 14:59
Team: TP

Post by Phillip »

SpeaK, what other factors are those? (Out of curiosity I would like to know)

What I mean is: When testing auto-play levels, the bike ends up differently on different rides (without pressing any keys). What other factors could there possibly be than small variations in the integral steps?

I am aware that you can adjust the physics updating according to framerate so the physics engine runs approximately the same on every machine, but there could still be small variations in timesteps along the ride.

Another thing: turning vsync on and off changes framerate, and also changes (IMO) the behaviour of the bike. If this is right then the elma physics must be dependant on framerate.

Recently I made a small flight simulator that has the same behaviour: I made the game engine update the physics 10 times every frame. (A smarter way would be to check framerate first, and then do less physics updates if framerate was good enough)

When I turned vsync off framerate went from 85 to 450, and the plane acted very differently. (this is also expected from the equations)
User avatar
chux
Kuski
Posts: 2636
Joined: 27 Aug 2002, 22:59
Location: Elmaville, UK

Post by chux »

Nat teh expert, but if the bike is different when you turn vsync on and off then surely its not about framerate so much as vertical syncronization? :roll:
I dream of a world where chickens can cross the road without their motives being questioned.
Image
Hi! I'm a signature virus. Copy me into your signature to help me spread.
User avatar
Stini
39mins club
Posts: 202
Joined: 5 Dec 2002, 22:15
Team: ICE
Location: Helsinki, Finland

Post by Stini »

chux wrote:Nat teh expert, but if the bike is different when you turn vsync on and off then surely its not about framerate so much as vertical syncronization? :roll:
Well, my framerate is over 400 with vsync off and maybe something like 80 with on, so vsync affects dramatically the framerate.
User avatar
chux
Kuski
Posts: 2636
Joined: 27 Aug 2002, 22:59
Location: Elmaville, UK

Post by chux »

Hmm, fair enough.
Something Ive never totally understood about framerate - if we see in 24 fps, surely everything above that is pointless...?
I dream of a world where chickens can cross the road without their motives being questioned.
Image
Hi! I'm a signature virus. Copy me into your signature to help me spread.
Phillip
Kuski
Posts: 95
Joined: 12 Sep 2002, 14:59
Team: TP

Post by Phillip »

chux wrote:Hmm, fair enough.
Something Ive never totally understood about framerate - if we see in 24 fps, surely everything above that is pointless...?
On a tv everything above 24 fps is pointless, because the TV-images automatically contain motion blur. On a computer screen, however, it's different, because games usually don't create images that are blurred.

If a bird flies across the screen on a tv and you freeze the image, you see a long blurred bird. In real life, "framerate" is approximately infinite, and your eyes/brain "creates" this motion blur.

On a computer however you need a lot more fps for the eye to create a realistic motion blur. If you have like 100 fps, the eye cathes 4 frames at a time, which means what you really see each moment is 4 birds next to each other. If it had been like real life or a good tv, it should have been one long blurred bird.

In theory, if a computer game creates perfect motion blur 24-25 fps should be enough for it to look realistic...
User avatar
chux
Kuski
Posts: 2636
Joined: 27 Aug 2002, 22:59
Location: Elmaville, UK

Post by chux »

Hmm, makes sense. I thought itd just be cos if you got the timing of the 24 fps slightly off then we'd see it all jerky :D
I dream of a world where chickens can cross the road without their motives being questioned.
Image
Hi! I'm a signature virus. Copy me into your signature to help me spread.
User avatar
chux
Kuski
Posts: 2636
Joined: 27 Aug 2002, 22:59
Location: Elmaville, UK

Post by chux »

chux wrote:Ok, so he posted his first thing on the 7th of September, then said we'll all know in half a year.
So if we dont hear anything by the 7th of March, then we'll all know for sure (yeah yeah, "as if we dont already") that hes full of shiat.
Well, ok, lets give him a bit of room, games often get pushed back, so how about 7th of April?
Ooh, according to SlenderBelly, Elma 2 is out :P
I dream of a world where chickens can cross the road without their motives being questioned.
Image
Hi! I'm a signature virus. Copy me into your signature to help me spread.
User avatar
Wezz
Kuski
Posts: 612
Joined: 2 Dec 2004, 21:46
Location: Denmark
Contact:

Post by Wezz »

Well, according to Santo (Daniel) ´s talk on elastomaniac i guess i know whats teh secret iz! Well, i havent read all posts, so maybe thiz ez mentioned, but i guess Balazs said that soon, Elma 2 will be published!
Wezz 1-100 Levels - PTL pack - ADLP Pack - CR Pack - My Website - Team Website - Proud member of TEM - DONT WANT A ELMA 2!!! My internal TT: 45:xx:xx - Team TEM TT: 39:xx:xx Image
teajay
Donator duck
Posts: 10043
Joined: 3 Apr 2003, 17:53

Post by teajay »

compared to the time until the sun has burned down, it might be very soon, yes.
User avatar
Xiphias
39mins club
Posts: 4098
Joined: 23 Nov 2004, 23:05

Post by Xiphias »

Well maybe this is just a veeeeery slow 1. April joke.
Thorze wrote:I just wanted to make a cool topic like Juish have cool topics..
User avatar
Wezz
Kuski
Posts: 612
Joined: 2 Dec 2004, 21:46
Location: Denmark
Contact:

Post by Wezz »

I guess not actually...On elastomaniac, he made a topic for a long time ago named "Elma 2 will come out soon!!!" or something, and there is what...10 pages now? And......I still dont really believe in this, but when he then writes he have insider information, and he wrote it here, it cant be other stuff than this! If u want teh link to teh thread, it ez here:
http://www.elastomaniac.com/showthread.php?t=691

Ive never really believed in it, but u know what? Maybe it EZ right....I really hope nat by teh way!
Wezz 1-100 Levels - PTL pack - ADLP Pack - CR Pack - My Website - Team Website - Proud member of TEM - DONT WANT A ELMA 2!!! My internal TT: 45:xx:xx - Team TEM TT: 39:xx:xx Image
User avatar
Abula
Moposite admin
Posts: 4449
Joined: 16 May 2002, 23:00
Team: FM
Location: Helsinki
Contact:

Post by Abula »

You think it's more true when more people have replied to that topic? Daniel got exactly the same info that everybody else who mailed Balázs back then. I have some Elma knowledge and humble forecast of mine is that Elma 2 won't be published in a year, at least.
40:02,71 (151.) | WCup4: 8. | 3x WR | 3x GAA | 11x FEM | KOM | The History of Elasto Mania (1995-2018)
User avatar
Wezz
Kuski
Posts: 612
Joined: 2 Dec 2004, 21:46
Location: Denmark
Contact:

Post by Wezz »

Great! That was what i hoped! I just had this feeling, since he wrote it all teh time....
Wezz 1-100 Levels - PTL pack - ADLP Pack - CR Pack - My Website - Team Website - Proud member of TEM - DONT WANT A ELMA 2!!! My internal TT: 45:xx:xx - Team TEM TT: 39:xx:xx Image
User avatar
chux
Kuski
Posts: 2636
Joined: 27 Aug 2002, 22:59
Location: Elmaville, UK

Post by chux »

Abula wrote:You think it's more true when more people have replied to that topic? Daniel got exactly the same info that everybody else who mailed Balázs back then. I have some Elma knowledge and humble forecast of mine is that Elma 2 won't be published in a year, at least.
I be teh n00b, but what was the information Balazs told everyone? :?
I dream of a world where chickens can cross the road without their motives being questioned.
Image
Hi! I'm a signature virus. Copy me into your signature to help me spread.
teajay
Donator duck
Posts: 10043
Joined: 3 Apr 2003, 17:53

Post by teajay »

Send him an email about the next version, and get it yourself. :P
User avatar
Kopaka
39mins club
Posts: 6610
Joined: 23 May 2002, 13:59
Team: LAME
Location: In a northern danish city beating YOUR record.
Contact:

Post by Kopaka »

chux: you can see the email somewhere in this topic.
Post Reply