elma NAB league

[Fredrik]

elma NAB league

[Ramone]

elma NAB league

"like"

[roope]

More angry feedback: levs really should be tested. My lev gives an internal error when trying to access it.


edit: ok got the lev working, but doesn't change my opinion as it's still impsy

[Ramone]

Error: you did not qualify for league.

and everyone gets this message when tries to up rec....

[pawq]

everything is fucked even more now :D) nab league(((((((

[ribot]

ye actually it was quite complicated... i can only apologize...
but to get designed levels is pretty difficult...
the only thing i can do now is fix the code for next week

[pawq]

so is there a way to postpone an event for a pair? either in the code or manually?

[ribot]

pwq: allegedly it could be made like that in code... but i don't think i will have time to do that... so for now it's not possible...

you can think of it this way: how big is the chance that both players will find a new time and both will remember to play it? multiply the probability with the probability of someone not being able to play a certain week... and then divide that by the time i actually have to code, subtracted by the time i actually have to code...

[pawq]

well, i probably don't play then. but we'll see if i get to the internets. I think non-playing guys should get some set penalties, is it like that atm?

[roope]

Most of the pairs can't dl levs o7

[Lousku]

I was credited for 2 anal cactuslevs. = - D

[Orcc]

So is it over with this league?

[ribot]

no it's still on... round 1 coming up! (but not for first division)

[SveinR]

Maybe better to just postpone the league several weeks until all bugs have been fixed?

[Fredrik]

SveinR is a wise man.

[Lousku]

Could we just hold test rounds more often than once a week until bugs are fixed? Depending on ribot's schedule, of course. Surely the real league can be postponed.

[pawq]

hahah, so I didn't miss anything after all :d good. And I'm for postponing it for the proper time too. EOL may be played with bugs, but not this :(

[ribot]

ye it's a good idea...of course i should have made test rounds before...but right now i have two jobs and then i'm going to india, so i don't know when i will have time to do that...

[gimp]

What the fuck ribot? league closed? i have been waiting all week for it, and you've been hyping it up for me over a much longer period of time too. i refuse to let you give up on this league, what do i have to do to motivate you to get it going?

[Orcc]

Teach him kegel exercising!

[gimp]

is this true ribot, would me teaching you how to do kegel exorcises make you restart elma league?

[ribot]

well the league is postponed...for now

[ville_j]

So.. I asked ribot and he said it would be ok if I arranged this. I've been thinking about it for few days and I guess I'm up for it. Because I'm me I will make an extensive site for this and it takes some time so this won't be happening any time soon. But it would be a good thing to start the discussion again now. I myself read through this topic to be aware of the problems this had. Here are some of the things I noted:

• Advertising
  I don't think this will be a problem.
• Point system
  Do we need any, or is it just win/lose.
• Duration and timing of the events
  This is probably the most important thing to consider. Is it enough to have them as just 60min eol battles or should it be longer, it is very easy to miss a regular battle.
• The form of the competition
  ribot had these different divisions which is great I think. One thing I considered is that there are no divisions. The ones who win progress straight to next level, the ones who lose have some extra 1vs1s and half of them will progress to the same level with the earlier winners. This means that when you lose 2 times in a row you drop out. I haven't really given these am extensive thinking yet.

I think I could write some more but I'm writing with my mobile so it's a bit pain in the ass. So I'll stop here and let you guys take part in the discussion.

[Lousku]

Great, Ville! :*

Point system
Do we need any, or is it just win/lose.

Depends on the format, but it's probably best to count only wins, losses and ties. Coming up with a complicated point system will only confuse people.

Duration and timing of the events
This is probably the most important thing to consider. Is it enough to have them as just 60min eol battles or should it be longer, it is very easy to miss a regular battle.

Important, yeah. It's really easy to miss a 60min battle even if it has been announced weeks in advance. A full week may be too much, because then you'd have to be really lucky to win with a casual 1-hour höylä session while the other player höyls all week. This shouldn't be about who has the most free time. If every pair has a separate level (like it was in ribot's system), there could be a "ready" button. Each pair is given a week to find time for their match. Whenever both are ready, they'll press the button and get the level. This obviously won't work if all pairs in a round have the same level. One major problem is levels. Generated? Same level for many pairs? It would be best to have separate levels for each pairing, but that takes some dedication from designers in the long run.

The form of the competition
ribot had these different divisions which is great I think. One thing I considered is that there are no divisions. The ones who win progress straight to next level, the ones who lose have some extra 1vs1s and half of them will progress to the same level with the earlier winners. This means that when you lose 2 times in a row you drop out. I haven't really given these am extensive thinking yet.

Simplicity is nice, but that might be too harsh. Divisions are great and I think ribot had a good system going (apart from the bugs).

Looking forward to this. =D

[ville_j]

Thanks for the input. Are others not interested in elma NAB league anymore, or are just waiting it to happen already? I'd really like to have some more comments on the topics I listed in my earlier post, but maybe it all is already said in this topic.

[Labs]

I wait for a knockout cup really long time, its almost that, so please arrange it. thx

[Orcc]

I think people are ez interested in playing teh, just whane everything working this time.

[Zweq]

when watcharing snouker world champs im thinking would be coal to have similar annual event with 16 top ranked kuskis and 16 through qualifications. hole prablem is to get ppl to actually play

[ville_j]

Good prablems. But how was ribot's system supposed to work? Different divisions yes but how many games played within each and how to progress and sach I duno and have to figure out before mayking anything and that's where I wanted some axxual opinions. I guess ppl will play yes no matter how shit the system is if it works but would be good to hear what would most think as a good formula.

[Labs]

I have an idea. Firstly qualification round and 32 players qualifies. First 8 going to differrent divisions, so you will have 8 divisions totally, each will have 4 players, the first 8 can select their opponents for his division, the winner of the qualification round starts to select one and this going to 8th player, after 8th player selected his opponent for his division, first can select again and this going until all division full (4 player/div). There should be a player selecting time in irc, if a player from top8 not there, then the player before him need to select one for his division, so if 7th player from the qualiround not there then 6th will select one for his division. Now we have 8 divs, in the divisions players will play against every player from his division in eol battle mode, each division will have the same lev. So after the qualiround there will be battles, totally hmmm like 3 and you get points if you beat a player from your division 1 for each, so you can get 9 points after all 3 battle, 2 from the division going through the next round, if after the 3 battle there will be players with same points, no problem, on the "next day" they will fight in a 4th battle (only the players which have same points and if they are on the 2-3 place, others can play but not counts). After 4th battle we will got 2 players from each divs so totally 16 left. Again 4 players per division, but now randomly, 3 battle after that and points, players after that with same points again fight in a 4th battle to going through next round (2 players qualificates) . 8 players left now there is, again random divs and 3 battle with a 4th samepointsquali. 4 players left now and this 4 makes again 3 balle, the first 2 going to a final battle. If 3-4 have same points they will play a balle too. And done.

Ofc you chooses how to make it.

[Kopaka]

[*] The form of the competition
ribot had these different divisions which is great I think. One thing I considered is that there are no divisions. The ones who win progress straight to next level, the ones who lose have some extra 1vs1s and half of them will progress to the same level with the earlier winners. This means that when you lose 2 times in a row you drop out. I haven't really given these am extensive thinking yet.[/list]

Well that way it's not a league it's extermination fak, which can be good too but I really like the idea of an elma league, meaning no one is exterminated at any point, all play till the end of a season and the one with most points wins, different divisions that you can promote and demote from (either two best/worse shift or some playoff between those). Raider arranged DBL(danish battle league) a long time ago which was great fun, that was just one division because of few danish players and only lasted one season sadly. In this everyone in the league played same level in a normal battle and best X got a fixed amount of points (like in a cup event). Elma is not really good for 1on1 especially considering the amount of levels that would require, and good levels is really important for any elma competition. So everyone against everyone (from that given division) might be best, and that worked well in DBL.

Looking at the amount that plays mopobattle and cups these days I'm guessing there won't be THAT many players, so it should be rather small divisions, maybe 10 players in each. Then some qualification first to divide players in divisions.

It's hard/impossible to get everyone to play every event, (also an argument for not doing 1on1, if someone doesn't play an event that's free points for the opponent) so you might consider some skipping system, like if there is 10 events first 8 results counts, meaning you can't take points from others in your ninth battle if are you are able to be there for more than 8 events. Ofcourse not too many skips either so there's not like only a few players left to play last event or such.

After a season new players should be able to join of course and they can be added to new divisions that are added to the buttom, letting people join 10 at a time, so you don't have a half filled division. If someone is inactive last 5 or so events of a season, he can be kicked out and 1 more player is promoted from divisions underneath, and gives 1 spot in last divison for a new player.

[*] Duration and timing of the events
This is probably the most important thing to consider. Is it enough to have them as just 60min eol battles or should it be longer, it is very easy to miss a regular battle.

I guess doing them as normal EOL battles is easiest, then just filtering out those not in the given division when you calculate the results for league site. With longer events it's gonna be more like a cup and too much if this is something that is going to last for years to come, which I hope. 30 min battle is enough imo.

I'm rooting for you to get this thing done, as an international elma battle league has been a dream of mine to see realised for a long time. I'm happy to help with any addictional API stuff or whatever you might need from EOL.

[snajdig]

I am in

[snajdig]

one division or group you can call it what you want. System according to football. Winner 3 points - draw: 1 point - loser: 0 points. Pairs ofc should play at the same time. Every pairs playing on a different lev. Playing time could be 1.5-2x times bigger than a norm battle time. System should be obvious and easy to understand.
Just an idea....
hope we will rock very

[Bismuth]

draw? lol

[ville_j]

Ugh, I kind of already forgot about this. I had some ideas but now I have some important projects going on and pasibel full-time job so yeah.. this is not happening any time soon. I don't wana mayke elma SUPER NAB league.

[snajdig]

Ugh, I kind of already forgot about this. I had some ideas but now I have some important projects going on and pasibel full-time job so yeah.. this is not happening any time soon. I don't wana mayke elma SUPER NAB league.

anyone else who would like to organize this league?