Vsync internal level list

General discussion about the games and the scene.

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culinko
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Post by culinko »

8-ball wrote:bullshit
everything is true except the last sentence :roll:
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Kopaka
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Post by Kopaka »

tijsjoris wrote:Labyrinth pro bounce is very doable with on.
Indeed, I did my lp bounces with on too. Not that I can't turn it off, just find it easier with on, or think I find it easier :).
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Post by Honza »

11. Gravity ride - ON - this level needs no special tricks so why off, I made 23,90 when had no idea about vsync(default is on), Off is maybe easier way to get time, but this is the kind of level where vsync off is just unnecessary luxus

44. Freefall - ON - yes, why not, same case as gravity ride, my 11,63 was made when all I played was ON, You don't need any lucky grip here, all you have to do is hoyling, of course OFF can be easier here, but now with off I cant even do the start now.
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Post by Palme »

Kopaka wrote:
tijsjoris wrote:Labyrinth pro bounce is very doable with on.
Indeed, I did my lp bounces with on too. Not that I can't turn it off, just find it easier with on, or think I find it easier :).
I agree, i heared about vsync at the second event of Mastercup 2 - so i did my lab pro bounce with on too! My time sucks, but the bounce was good XD

Lukazz once told me that he drives lab pro and enigma with on, cuz he too thinks it s easier ;)

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Post by teajay »

I always try to use off as much as possible, I find it very unnatural to play with on, it feels like the bike is slower than I'm pushing the buttons with on.
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Lukazz
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Post by Lukazz »

yep i agree, on feels strange when you play with off for a long time
and yes, i do enigma with on because i can't do over killers with off, when i hoyled the level i did over killers 1/3
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Zweq
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Post by Zweq »

the list is pretty simple, but it's all about fps how elma works apparently and having vsync on and adjust refresh rate is one way to change playability. For example I can adjust fps to 60 70 72 75 85 100 120 140 144 and the cruel truth is that 70, 72 or 75 give chances for sink wr when any other fps it goes nxt to impossible get under 32.80. Then again I don't have much clue are there other factors and also is there a program to 'force' play elma with certain fps, dunno if that would be 'lame' but...yea that's what this shit has gone to
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Post by dz »

Zweq wrote:is there a program to 'force' play elma with certain fps, dunno if that would be 'lame' but...yea that's what this shit has gone to
I don't understand why don't someone skilled just make a simple prog to limit fps to certain value. That way all the vsync shit could be forgotten. Maybe there is one already?

Though it would be a problem for those who cannot change vsync off, because that would be a requirement. If vsync is on, there is no way to get above the limitation of monitor refresh rate, to my knowledge.

Btw I am one of those who cannot change it off, at least I don't know a way to do that under linux.
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Grace
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Post by Grace »

i dunno how to so i do vsync on all the time aswell.
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Post by Juski »

the problem with that dz is that you can set the fps to high and make it lagg and get some secs cut off your time or something?
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Post by A.K.B. »

my "super duper" lp bounce was with on, i thought that on was better for bounces then off.......

i guess I haven't ever played (only once at Jebus's house) so I wouldn't know really.... I just heard it was good for having grip.
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Post by dz »

Juski wrote:the problem with that dz is that you can set the fps to high and make it lagg and get some secs cut off your time or something?
I don't quite understand what you're trying to say..
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Post by veezay »

since vsync has so much to do with how the bike acts, the reason must be the physics calculation and how often it's done. with vsync off (fps is higher) elma makes more calculations per second so when you're doing bounce, there's much more wicked calculations going on so the outcome might be better, bigger or more insane bounce. possibly.

one reason i could think of for better grip when vsync off, is rounding errors. when your wheel is about to come off ground, the position of wheel gets rounded so close to ground that it's still actually locked to it (the more calculations per second, the less difference in the result). compared to vsync on, the wheel has more time to get further from the ground between every frame's calculations and so the grip decreases. i guess milagros could do more precise investigation how all this happens inside elma, but at least it would seem logical.

with vsync off you get something like 200-400 fps, and when you switch timer off you can get ~double, in case one would need teh. map doesn't affect much. of course that doesn't work with vsync on.

for mcup2's second event i first needed to have low fps for the apple and then high fps to get wheel through the annoying "vsync-hole", so i set vsync off and made my music software to generate some cpu-heavy sounds silently to get ~100fps with timer on. when i got to the vsync-hole, i switched timer off to get double and the wheel went straight through without any problems. ez tuning? 8)
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Post by Zweq »

nice post veetseta and there's nothing new using winamp or such to get cpu usage up and lower fps, I used that in shelf life 3-4 years ago. Nowadays that's impossible though with too powerful cpus, like I'm having almost 900 fps vsync off, timer on, 1800 timer off (mila said elma is limited to 30-999 fps though).

One crazy tune level is uphill battle where I think the best brutals are found between 150-300 fps, unfortunately it's impossible to test it without some fps limiter prog, can only test couple of fps values between 60-144 thanks to vsync on, but that's it, then the next step is 800 fps with vsync off :(. And 800 fps sucks ass on uphill battle brutal, 144 felt a lot closer, but braked too much. So I'm guessing overloading cpu to get 200ish fps(aka computer from 90s) would give nice n juicy 19.xx uphill battle times.

what's your fps jarkko? ;)
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Post by Jarkko »

Zweq wrote:what's your fps jarkko? ;)
I don't know, but I got that 19:98 time on my computer, which is AMD XP 2000+ and GF6600GT, pretty old already. 150Hz and VSYNC off. But nowadays I can't do that good bounces anymore, maybe it's some driver thing, graphics card driver.

That 19:96 I got with my sisters computer, which has AMD Sempron 3200+, some cheap graphics card and LCD monitor with 60Hz and VSYNC off, of course. So, maybe this has better fps, I don't know.

EDIT: Okay, I checked with fraps and there sure is difference. I have 240-250 fps and my sister has over 1200 fps.
Last edited by Jarkko on 12 Feb 2007, 14:07, edited 2 times in total.
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Post by milagros »

Zweq wrote:(mila said elma is limited to 30-999 fps though)
it's 30-1000
if it runs slower (less than 30fps), elma counts it in more steps like it was 30fps
1000fps is max due to the timer that has 1ms resolution and if the difference between last 2 frames is 0, then frame counting is skipped
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Post by Zweq »

Jarkko wrote:
Zweq wrote:what's your fps jarkko? ;)
I don't know, but I got that 19:98 time on my computer, which is AMD XP 2000+ and GF6600GT, pretty old already. 150Hz and VSYNC off. But nowadays I can't do that good bounces anymore, maybe it's some driver thing, graphics card driver.

That 19:96 I got with my sisters computer, which has AMD Sempron 3200+, some cheap graphics card and LCD monitor with 60Hz and VSYNC off, of course. So, maybe this has better fps, I don't know.

EDIT: Okay, I checked with fraps and there sure is difference. I have 240-250 fps and my sister has over 1200 fps.
interesting, I just suck then
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Post by anpdad »

weird. My really old 20,5x i got with an extremely low fps. Some geforce 5200 MX or smth i had + Athlon XP 2100+ (i lowered CPU speed to 1500+, so it is about ~1300 MHz cuz it burnt the thing that i dunno how is called in english EIGHT TIMES in a week. Yes, that's Russian electricity in small towns). Don't think my comment is useless, cuz i had a really good brutal that time. At least i wasn't loosing to John's 20:13 (if my memory doesnt fail me) rec 'till the very end. So my fps was something like 110-150.
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Post by Xiphias »

I've just bought a new laptop.. and I did some tests on elma.
As for saving power, it's possible to adjust surten things, like cpu speed, air cooling, light and other stuff.
I tested all 6 different 'cpu speeds' and checked the fps.

Specs:
1 GB DDR II SDRAM
Intel Core 2 Duo 2 GHz
Video memory: 256 MB DDR SDRAM (guess this is the ATI card)
ATI MOBILITY RADEON X1600 med op til (with up to) 512 MB HyperMemory / PCI Express x16 / 2048 x 1536 / 32-bit farve


I've got 0 idea off which levels are good with X amount of fps. Maybe someone could make a list?

And maybe some day someone will make a fps forcer prog suitable for elma =P

Code: Select all

CPU Speed Something
Behandlings Hastighed (Normal profile)

Elma
 Resolution: 800x600
 Zoom	   : 1.60
 Center Cam: On
 Timer     : Off

 Vsync     : Off

Without Power Cable

Niveau	FPS
6	   305-309
5	   299-305 
4	   293-297 
3	   282-287	 
2	   183-187  
1	   123-125

With Power Cable
Niveau  FPS
6	   999
5	   999
4	   915-960
3	   750-785
2	   480-490
1	   300-310

------------------
Cpu Speed Something
Behandlings Hastighed (Normal Profile)

Elma
 Resolution: 800x600
 Zoom	   : 1.60
 Center Cam: On
 Timer     : Off

 Vsync     : On

With cable
Niveau	FPS
6	   60-61
5	   60-61
4	   60-61
3	   60-61
2	   60-61
1	   60-61
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Lukazz
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Post by Lukazz »

i have a problem with my vsync. sometimes when i restart my computer i have vsync on, even when i have set it off. then after some minutes (or hours, dunno) it gets off. that's very annoying when you want to hoyl a level which needs off =/
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Kopaka
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Post by Kopaka »

Guess we would need some more info to help you, what gfx card? what do you use for changing vsync?
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Xiphias
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Post by Xiphias »

I have to start ATI Catalyst center to use vsync off.. else it's on
I find this quite nice.. coz else i'd have to go all the way trough settings and stuff.. now ez just open or close :P
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Post by teajay »

Hoah, that is new to me. So I am using on when ati cataclyst is off?
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Lukazz
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Post by Lukazz »

hm, i solved the problem myself, when i'm running any other programm in background it works o_O, and i noticed it's not vsync on, but the wheel is still able to go trough the shel life shortcut for example.
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Kopaka
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Post by Kopaka »

That ati catalyst center has different gfx options, including vsync, so I guess you have vsync turned off in catalyst center, and when you close it, it goes back to normal.

I use that catalyst center aswell for vsync, in the version I have, I can make profiles and then desktop shortcuts or key shortcuts for those profiles. So it's pretty easy to turn on and off. :)
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Palme
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Post by Palme »

Can you turn it off during you play elma per clicking for example "a"?

That would be great ;)
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Kopaka
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Post by Kopaka »

Just tried that, and no, you can't. You have to minimize elma before it applies.
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